evaluating coins for strike

[Davids5104]

I am reasonably good at picking nickels and dimes out for grading.  I had a primarily Jefferson war nickel submission and didnt get surprised with many low grades.  What I believe I am not good at is strike evaluation.  I understand the term, but I believe I am unable to tell the difference between a 65 and a 67 when they look the same in hand.  I even have counted marks on the surface with 5X magnification to figure out why one is different than the other.  I believe it is not the luster or the surface that I am missing but the strike.  I feel like this should be the easiest of the grading concepts to have but I dont.  I have books and plenty of examples.  Any tips?  I DID get surprised on two of the cleaned coins on the submission

 

[Six Mile Rick]

O-K so we have tried to get all MS67's or better. My first thought as I look at the grades is 64 to 66. look at the rim field areas real close. Propper lighting is VERY IMPORTANT!! I found all the MS65 and MS66 coins to have a small section of field area where the trash from minting slowly starts to build up. It starts as a small hit look but is actually a small piece of scrap that has connected to the die that builds up and gets bigger, Kinda like a dirty corner.  Your fields need to be clear so that the metal will flow properly when the coin is minted. The flow of a perfect clean die is actually pretty awesome in the light to see when the dies are new. You can see the direction of flow of the compressed metal. When you see it --- You know it's a top submission piece!! The luster is a big + when you want a 66 to grade a 67 or a 67 to grade a 68. Picking pretty much the PL looking coins from your submissions and checking the total rim field areas will get your submission costs down and leave you with the better choices to submit.

JMO --- Rick

[Six Mile Rick]

Do you use an incandescent bulb for searching your coin rolls? Add a 6X loup and wala --- No more cleaned coins with details submissions..  

 

2nd --- DON'T try to build a set on a submission!! ------  Look for the right coins. No matter what you are looking at. If it is a hole filler needed and you submit it --- then you will likely submit it because you want it, not because it is worthy of submission fees.. Look at the submission one final time before you submit it. Night time ( with NO sunlight involved), not looking at dates. Lay them all out under your light and go through them. The best 5 out of 30 or 100 will show their self. 

 I soon will be doing the dimes and nickels as well. Not to build a set of each series but to pick the best of those that I have saved over the years. My office here at home has 6 windows in it. I only look at coins for searching after the sun goes down and just the light from the grading lamp is involved. All light scratches from cleaning show up like a cloudy mess. Small nicks and debris on die show like what I call stars (starry fields). 3 stars and they are out. You can set all the coins in groups as you look at them from cloudy, starry, luster and awesome. There are your grades -- details to MS68

Good Luck!!  

Rick

[Davids5104]

these were all from war nickel sets i bought.  I picked maybe one or two coins out of each set that looked worthy.  The problem is a war nickel in MS-66 is a trash grade to submit.  if you divide your 85 dollar acquistion over the 11 coins and then grading fees, you cant make a buck doing that.  So, I am trying to eliminate the 65's completely and increase the 67's but that is my problem currently.  I am not smart enough to tell the difference.   I will take your advice Rick and look at the rims.  I just bought a hastings loupe too.

[Six Mile Rick]

Look at your submission. NGC is giving you a guide to look at. 1942-P you have 3 graded --- MS65, MS66, and MS67. Clearly looking at those three graded coins you will see what you are missing. If you don't see it in the fields ---- you are using the wrong light. A propper light for your vision will show you every detail in the fields including improper cleaning.

[Six Mile Rick]

P.S. ---- Most war nickel sets that were packaged and sold by dealers and companies were searched prior to building. I would do the same today!!  Send the best I could find into TPG for grading and package the sets for sale on e-bay. Have you thought of purchasing a few OLD fresh rolls to search? There are dealers with old saved rolls of nickels that have coins in them that no dealers have cherry picked. That is where you are going to find your beloved MS67 5FS!!

[Six Mile Rick]

Roll searching is much better than searching sets that were built by others. It actually trains your eye to search for die wear  (better or worse) as you look through a few rolls of consecutive minted coins.

[Six Mile Rick]

Look at the Jefferson nickel and Roosevelt dime. They get great grades with full steps and full torch designs. They also get great grades when compromised within the design of steps or full torch from trash build up within the design. The grade lowers when the fields are compromised.

 Every time I see a Jefferson nickel graded MS67 or MS68 and the dealer is stating -- Almost 5 full steps or 4 full steps ---- I Laugh!!!  

[WoodenJefferson]

Out guessing the grading services is like trying to hit a screwball. Just when you think you have a pretty good handle on what a potential grade a coin should grade out at, your thrown one of those screwballs. Anticipation of exactly where to swing is usually a miss. There were hundreds if not thousands of working dies needed to strike the nickels associated with this date run. The newer the die, the better the strike, it's that simple really. You have to remember, these coins were destined for circulation and if they looked like a nickel, that was good enough for the Mints. It's the 'collector' who has to sift through the masses to pick out the higher grades for their collection or submissions. The only 'tip' I can tell you is 'time' as it takes time to understand the concept of accurately grading a coin. Different series have different criteria so learning one series inside and out is a good start. You had a bunch of 67's in that submission so you must be doing something right...find out what that is and learn from that experience, self taught coin grading is not a piece of cake, it takes trial and error to gain the knowledge to be consistent.

 

Note: I cannot grade gold worth a darn as I'm all over the place. I don't collect gold so no harm, no foul. 

[coinman1794]

Strike is probably not the main problem, unless you have coins that are flat or mushy. The presence or absence of Full Steps certainly has no baring on grade, for example.

The services have said in the past that they do not grade with loops, unless they are looking at a perceived problem.

The number of marks is less important than the placement and appearance of the marks.

An MS67 has to have a certain "look" about it. You can have a coin that's as clean as a 68 that ends up as a 66- because it doesn't have the right luster, or a toning streak that takes away from the eye appeal in some way, etc. You can have a lightly bag marked coin with technical 65 surfaces that grades 66-67 because the luster is out of this world, and the strike is perfect, and the coin has "the look."

As others have said, use your submission as a grading set to figure out what they saw that you did not.