Is this "CAC" thing a load of *spoon* or what? 0

[GoldFinger1969]

On 6/24/2022 at 4:36 AM, MarkFeld said:

I’m sure CAC can see and evaluate smaller coins, just fine.

You don't think that the much smaller fields play a part ? 

[MarkFeld]

On 6/24/2022 at 8:55 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

You don't think that the much smaller fields play a part ? 

Was my previous answer unclear? 

[GoldFinger1969]

On 6/24/2022 at 10:20 AM, MarkFeld said:

Was my previous answer unclear? 

No, it's just that it seems logical that as a coin shrinks, it is harder to see imperfections.  Especially when human judgement is involved.

[Oldhoopster]

On 6/24/2022 at 12:13 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

No, it's just that it seems logical that as a coin shrinks, it is harder to see imperfections.  Especially when human judgement is involved.

Maybe not the best analogy, but assume a bond portfolio manager is looking for key information from a prospectus (or whatever you use).  Some may be long and full of fluff, others may be short and succinct.  Regardless, you know what info you need and how to find it.  Just because it may be harder to find in some doesn't mean you're not going to do your job and find it

I'll make a blanket statement and say that professional graders are trained to look for defects whether that's on a 3Cent silver or double eagle.  If they're there, they will see them regardless of the coin size.

[USAuPzlBxBob]

I'm a fan of CAC.  Their "beans" — what they suggest on a holder, especially a white-background NGC holder — add class and interest to the overall presentation.

I submitted three coins to them through Central Jersey Rare Coins, and it was a great experience.

Two out of three got the beaned.

[GoldFinger1969]

On 6/24/2022 at 12:39 PM, Oldhoopster said:

I'll make a blanket statement and say that professional graders are trained to look for defects whether that's on a 3Cent silver or double eagle.  If they're there, they will see them regardless of the coin size.

I don't disagree with you, OldH.  But as we know, graders miss things and at other times focus on different variables.  A coin with a few extra dings or rim damage might escape a lower grade because of great luster, etc.

I'm sure the expert graders are good at what they do.  But a newcomer....recently hired...or someone getting tired at the end of a long day ?

People make mistakes and miss things.  It happens -- humans can't be perfect.

[World Colonial]

On 6/24/2022 at 1:50 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

People make mistakes and miss things.  It happens -- humans can't be perfect.

The problem I have is with the subjective application of "market acceptable", with the coins I collect.

I have had it go both ways on my submissions and it makes no sense.  The worst example was two coins of the exact same mint, year, and denomination.  The first is graded XF-40 which was 50-50 to me whether it would receive a numerical grade.  It's not a particularly attractive coin but is for this mint and design since practically all are complete "dreck".  The second is much better but came back "AU details" due to "surface hairlines".  I was aware this might happen but hoped it wouldn't because of what I am writing here.

Yes, it's been cleaned at some point (virtually all have) but it had nice peripheral toning on one side and light hairlines in the fields on the other. It's water under the bridge now since the USPS lost the package on the way back from NGC.

I also have a third coin which is in an "XF Details" holder with gold and blue toning on both sides with somewhat more noticeable hairlines in the fields on one.  I consider it "market acceptable" to anyone who actually collects this series.

[GoldFinger1969]

On 6/24/2022 at 2:15 PM, World Colonial said:

The first is graded XF-40 which was 50-50 to me whether it would receive a numerical grade... Yes, it's been cleaned at some point (virtually all have) but it had nice peripheral toning on one side and light hairlines in the fields on the other.....I also have a third coin which is in an "XF Details" holder with gold and blue toning on both sides with somewhat more noticeable hairlines in the fields on one.  I consider it "market acceptable" to anyone who actually collects this series.

Did you see my post which quoted JA on XF coins and grades ?

EDIT: Yup, you did. 

Edited June 24, 2022 by GoldFinger1969

[zadok]

On 6/24/2022 at 12:13 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

No, it's just that it seems logical that as a coin shrinks, it is harder to see imperfections.  Especially when human judgement is involved.

...its called a loupe....

[zadok]

On 6/24/2022 at 1:50 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

I don't disagree with you, OldH.  But as we know, graders miss things and at other times focus on different variables.  A coin with a few extra dings or rim damage might escape a lower grade because of great luster, etc.

I'm sure the expert graders are good at what they do.  But a newcomer....recently hired...or someone getting tired at the end of a long day ?

People make mistakes and miss things.  It happens -- humans can't be perfect.

...."humans can't be perfect"...???...who said that? wheres ur empirical data? certain members here will want to know...i demand a recount...i cant believe ive been existing under a false pretense all these years....basically, a coin can not be empirically "graded" regardless of what some here mite want u to belive...every coin is unique especially so in circ coins...actually, "evaluated" would be a better choice rather than "graded"...the latter means diff things to diff people...graders will remain human because machines cant "evaluate"...subjectivity will remain a part of the calculus......thankfully....

[VKurtB]

On 6/24/2022 at 11:44 AM, USAuPzlBxBob said:

I'm a fan of CAC.  Their "beans" — what they suggest on a holder, especially a white-background NGC holder — add class and interest to the overall presentation.

I submitted three coins to them through Central Jersey Rare Coins, and it was a great experience.

Two out of three got the beaned.

I limit my purchase of flattened beans to the frijoles that are on my plate at Los Arcos Restaurant on the Parkway. 

[VKurtB]

On 6/25/2022 at 7:43 AM, zadok said:

...its called a loupe....

And a 30x loupe at that, if you’re Quintus.