Toned 21 Peace... Thoughts... GTG

[TonerGuy]

 

 

Hard to find 21 Peace $ toned - even rim toned... I'm thinking auburn/russet and blues around the rim.

 

Its always fun trying to grade 21 Peace $ - GTG...

[Yankeejose]

AU details- the head looks like it was polished.

[morganguru]

In a PCGS slab? Don't know if it's the image but it appears cleaned/buffed, I'm ok with the toning and looks to be in the AU category.

[RWB]

Personally, I don't like it.

 

Poorly defined EF, but altered surfaces. Unattractive "gunk-type" tarnish. Reminds me of what some of those big ad people in CW sell as "choice BU."

 

(Of course, it's a photo....might be better/worse live.)

[TonerGuy]

Personally, I don't like it.

 

Poorly defined XF, but altered surfaces. Unattractive "gunk-type" tarnish.

(Of course, it's a photo....might be better/worse live.)

 

That was my first thought exactly...

 

Then I saw that ICG graded it MS63. Well I know that ICG is not exactly the best grading company but could they make that big of a mistake ?

 

A cleaned XF = MS63 under ICG's grading standards... maybe but worth a look.

 

And as for the gunk type of tarnish - I think I might get lucky and it could be blue like on the reverse...

 

Either way I have 14 days to return it...

 

[BillJones]

The color looks "manufactured" to me. The flatness in the center on both sides is both a matter of a weak strike (typical) and some rub. The looks like a worked on AU to me.

[MarkFeld]

I don't see any evidence of cleaning or polishing. I would have guessed the coin to be a weakly struck AU55-58, with a shot at MS63, depending upon how it looked in hand. In other words, I think that, as a group, the previous posters have been overly harsh.

[RWB]

Folks should be glad I don't own a "grading" company.....and just scribble stuff.

[wdrob]

 

What amazed me most about this one was the poor quality of the pictures. I thought it was a joke at first. I mean .... who takes pictures at 640 x 480 these days?

 

I take from your post that you bought it and it remains to be seen just how far off the pictures are. You might have scored a winner.

 

Good luck!

 

 

[zboyle04]

i also thought head looks polished, i still like it though, i like darker toning, and like you said toned 21 peace dollars are a really hard find

[coinman_23885]

Then I saw that ICG graded it MS63. Well I know that ICG is not exactly the best grading company but could they make that big of a mistake ?

 

A cleaned XF = MS63 under ICG's grading standards... maybe but worth a look.

 

I purchased a 1937-D 3 Legged Buffalo Nickel in an ICG MS63 holder, that in hand was a whizzed AU coin. I wasn't very good at interpreting (intentionally?) poor eBay images at the time. I did receive a refund minus $25 in return shipping, so it ended up being okay.

 

Overall, I'm inclined to agree with RWB. Weak strike notwithstanding, it doesn't look like a mint state coin to me and the surfaces look off to me.

[TonerGuy]

I'm somewhere between Mark's opinion and everyone else.

 

It might be a cleaned AU example or it may be a weakly struck MS63.

 

Its worth the price of return shipping to find out. If it is an MS63 and the toning is nice and not gunky then its definitely worth it.

[Raisethis2]

You can tell by the pictures that the reverse has some "pop", The pictures are not very good but we'll just need to see it in hand to know more.

 

 

[Kurtdog]

ICG knows what it's doing. And, after all, this is market grading. If this coin is AU, the color helped up it. When an AU coin ups to MS, it bypasses the scuffed-up grades, and ups to at least MS63. For another TPG's money, for their market, who knows what they want to call it? In my opinion, for my money, it's very plausible at that market MS63.

[coinman1794]

 

 

Hard to find 21 Peace $ toned - even rim toned... I'm thinking auburn/russet and blues around the rim.

 

Its always fun trying to grade 21 Peace $ - GTG...

 

I don't think it could have been graded from the pictures provided. 1921 (or high relief) Peace dollars come flatly struck in the centers, and the resolution does not show enough detail to determine if there was any wear on top of that or not.

 

As for the color, it could be natural, but it could also be AT, and I don't care for it, based only on the images.

 

[BillJones]

ICG knows what it's doing. And, after all, this is market grading. If this coin is AU, the color helped up it. When an AU coin ups to MS, it bypasses the scuffed-up grades, and ups to at least MS63. For another TPG's money, for their market, who knows what they want to call it? In my opinion, for my money, it's very plausible at that market MS63.

 

ICG might know what they are doing, but my general observation about them is that their grading standards are more lax that those applied by NGC and PCGS. A lot of people in my local club have their coins certified by ICG because the company is located in the area, and it has their representatives set up at the local shows to take grading submissions.

 

I often find their grades in the Mint State (60 to 70) are usually 1 to 5 points higher than what I would have graded the coin. (The 5 point spread covers the situation when they grade what I call an AU-58, as an MS-64.) That does not say that all of their coins are over graded. I have seen examples where their grade was the same as mine, but in general I have been them to be less conservative.

 

As for this piece the toning on it, in the photo, looks like some of the artificial toning I used to see in the 1980s. It looked fairly natural, but the coins had a certain gloss them, which I see on the reverse of this piece. The caveat is that I am basing this on a photo with the picture taken at something other than a 90 degree angle. The coin might be okay, but I somehow think that it is something less than MS-63.