1964-D Peace Dollar
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19Lyds   
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Has anybody seen the Oct 11th Online Issue of Coin World Regarding Daniel Carr's 1964-D Peace Dollar?

 

Some of the folks across the street love it, others hate it, while still others think its illegal.

 

What's your opinion?

Edited by 19Lyds

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WoodenJefferson   
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I was actually getting nauseous with 27 eleven threads ATS about every facet of legitimacy of DCarr's 64-D Peace dollar and how it effects the market, past, present & future.

 

Although a nice re-strike reproduction/copy...I still say it violates the Hobby Protection Act and will come to tuition within the next 6 months.

 

Get yours early before the raid/confiscation begins.

 

I did not order one and will not.

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halfpint   
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...i did see the article. the peace bucks are a favorite of mine and i think

 

dan is a gifted 'maker' of the 64's. i did enjoy the CW write-up. :popcorn:

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James_OldeTowne   
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Has anybody seen the Oct 11th Online Issue of Coin World Regarding Daniel Carr's 1964-D Peace Dollar?

 

Some of the folks across the street love it, others hate it, while still others think its illegal.

 

What's your opinion?

Actually... I bought one! I had no idea it was controversial ATS, however.

 

The coin is astoundingly well done, however, I happen to think it is illegal to manufacture, since it imitates as genuine U.S. Mint product. And this is part of the reason why I bought one! This way, when someone walks up and wants to sell me his mega-rarity, I can whip out my '64-D and demonstrate that it is just a fantasy piece.

 

Maybe I'll start a thread with pics.

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halfpint   
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...yeah but when you whip out your mega-rarity you're liable to have someone

 

point out the 'give-away' mint-mark signature of dan's copy.

 

64-Dmintmark.jpg

 

... :whistle:

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Coinsman63   
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Has anybody seen the Oct 11th Online Issue of Coin World Regarding Daniel Carr's 1964-D Peace Dollar?

 

Some of the folks across the street love it, others hate it, while still others think its illegal.

 

What's your opinion?

Actually... I bought one! I had no idea it was controversial ATS, however.

 

The coin is astoundingly well done, however, I happen to think it is illegal to manufacture, since it imitates as genuine U.S. Mint product. And this is part of the reason why I bought one! This way, when someone walks up and wants to sell me his mega-rarity, I can whip out my '64-D and demonstrate that it is just a fantasy piece.

 

Maybe I'll start a thread with pics.

 

It's illegal to sell it as a genuine U.S. Mint coin when in fact it is not, and it supposed to be marked as COPY or REPLICA as per the the HPA.

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MarkFeld   
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...yeah but when you whip out your mega-rarity you're liable to have someone

 

point out the 'give-away' mint-mark signature of dan's copy.

 

 

... :whistle:

There are plenty of copies or otherwise bogus coins sold to unsuspecting/uneducated buyers, which have more significant giveaways that that.

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BillJones   
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I don't care for this piece because it does not have "COPY" as required by law. I think that it is no more than a glorified silver round, but I've heard numbers as high $1,000 for it.

 

Come on guys, this thing is nothing but a copy of a fantasy coin. Unlike other items like the Bashlow Confederate cents and the Scott restrikes of the Confederate half dollar, this thing has no connection at all with the genuine article. As such it does nothing for me as a collectors’ item. But that’s my opinion.

 

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halfpint   
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...yeah but when you whip out your mega-rarity you're liable to have someone

 

point out the 'give-away' mint-mark signature of dan's copy.

 

 

... :whistle:

There are plenty of copies or otherwise bogus coins sold to unsuspecting/uneducated buyers, which have more significant giveaways that that.

 

...buyer beware. (shrug)

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PerryHall   
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The U.S. Mint says all 1964-D peace dollars were melted and none now exists. How is it possible to "COPY" something that doesn't exist? This is not a counterfeit since no real examples exist. This would more properly be called a fantasy coin. There were a few dozen threads concerning this coin on the PCGS coin forums but they were all locked or deleted. Apparently PCGS wants to pretend these coins don't exist or they think by deleting these threads fewer forum members will know about them.

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MarkFeld   
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The U.S. Mint says all 1964-D peace dollars were melted and none now exists. How is it possible to "COPY" something that doesn't exist? This is not a counterfeit since no real examples exist. This would more properly be called a fantasy coin. There were a few dozen threads concerning this coin on the PCGS coin forums but they were all locked or deleted. Apparently PCGS wants to pretend these coins don't exist or they think by deleting these threads fewer forum members will know about them.
Based on the applicable language in the Hobby Protection Act, I am not convinced that there needs to be recognition/proof of a genuine one, for these to be considered "copies".

 

"(d) Imitation numismatic item means an item which purports to be, but in fact is not, an original numismatic item or which is a reproduction, copy, or counterfeit of an original numismatic item. Such term includes an original numismatic item which has been altered or modified in such a manner that it could reasonably purport to be an original numismatic item other than the one which was altered or modified. The term shall not include any re-issue or re-strike of any original numismatic item by the United States or any foreign government."

 

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bsshog40   
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As someone already stated, I also belive nothing more than an over-rated fantasy coin. $1,000 for a one ounce silver coin that isn't even legal tender????:insane:

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MarkFeld   
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As someone already stated, I also belive nothing more than an over-rated fantasy coin. $1,000 for a one ounce silver coin that isn't even legal tender????:insane:
They have been sold in the low $100 range - let's not take the $1000 figure and run with it, just because someone threw out that price ;)

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Bugmann1974   
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I think it is a cool novelty piece but I wouldn't pay much more than melt for one. I have no clue or opinions on the legalities of it.

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RWB   
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Counterfeit however you write about it. Lower quality than the better Chinese fakes. Totally unjustifiable, ethically bankrupt and morally repugnant. The perpetrator deserves whatever penalty comes to him.

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bsshog40   
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As someone already stated, I also belive nothing more than an over-rated fantasy coin. $1,000 for a one ounce silver coin that isn't even legal tender????:insane:
They have been sold in the low $100 range - let's not take the $1000 figure and run with it, just because someone threw out that price ;)

I thought this was a price that they were saying these were going for ATS also Mark?? I know it was well over $100.

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robec1347   
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As someone already stated, I also belive nothing more than an over-rated fantasy coin. $1,000 for a one ounce silver coin that isn't even legal tender????:insane:
They have been sold in the low $100 range - let's not take the $1000 figure and run with it, just because someone threw out that price ;)

I thought this was a price that they were saying these were going for ATS also Mark?? I know it was well over $100.

 

They started at $115 and has since been raised to $125. I'm sure there are plenty that hope it hits $1000. :)

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MarkFeld   
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As someone already stated, I also belive nothing more than an over-rated fantasy coin. $1,000 for a one ounce silver coin that isn't even legal tender????:insane:
They have been sold in the low $100 range - let's not take the $1000 figure and run with it, just because someone threw out that price ;)

I thought this was a price that they were saying these were going for ATS also Mark?? I know it was well over $100.

Low $100 range, not $1000 range.

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djdilliodon   
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While i can appreciate the peace dollar the real ones of course, I do not find this fantasy silver round appealing. The quality of the coin imo from seeing the various pics ATS is terrible. Dcarr would have been better off using a fresh planchet blank rather then over striking on older coins.

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James_OldeTowne   
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My opinion is apparently much different from that of some folks whom I respect very much :) !

 

In my opinion, they are definitely not counterfeit coins, they are "altered" coins, though I question whether the alteration is legal.

 

Are hobo nickels illegal? Are colorized coins illegal? Are cutout coins illegal? No, but all are alterations.

 

I brought up a similar scenario some time ago, whereby an 1802 bust dollar had the date altered to 1804. Then, it was re-altered back to an 1802. So is it still a genuine coin? I personally think it is.

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bsshog40   
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As someone already stated, I also belive nothing more than an over-rated fantasy coin. $1,000 for a one ounce silver coin that isn't even legal tender????:insane:
They have been sold in the low $100 range - let's not take the $1000 figure and run with it, just because someone threw out that price ;)

I thought this was a price that they were saying these were going for ATS also Mark?? I know it was well over $100.

 

They started at $115 and has since been raised to $125. I'm sure there are plenty that hope it hits $1000. :)

Well I guess some of the threads I was reading ATS were exagerating prices then. That was where I had gotten that high price also. I feel a little better about these knowing the real prices. I have a proposed design coin that I paid $99 for and feel that is ok for those that want a souvenir coin.

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Coindude   
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The reports of $1000 range come from the first 200 struck which were struck more than once and in satin. I think the asking price of 1k is way high and those owners will never see it.

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19Lyds   
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I have sent Coin World a Letter to the Editor to do with as they wish.

TD

Great Tom! Opinions and feelings need to be expressed and since Coin World ran the article, I expect next week's letters section to be over run with opinions.

 

My feelings are that the legality is very gray and the only way it can actually be cleared up is from the legal standpoint. So far, nothing but opinions have been offered up and names have been tossed around but.............that could all change and very quickly if the right people are made aware so that the legality can be addressed.

 

From what I understand, questions were asked of the FTC, the US Treasury and the Secret Service yet nobody from any any of the organizations made a statement or took a stand.

 

Perhaps now they will?

 

Perhaps a legal precedent will be set regarding importation of counterfeits from China?

 

Todate, NOBODY has done a damned thing to address the issues and concerns of the hobby (business). Maybe, that will all change.

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James_OldeTowne   
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Well I guess some of the threads I was reading ATS were exagerating prices then. That was where I had gotten that high price also. I feel a little better about these knowing the real prices. I have a proposed design coin that I paid $99 for and feel that is ok for those that want a souvenir coin.

Seems like I paid $110, or something like that.

 

One annoyance (tsk) is that it was shipped to me in a PVC flip.

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19Lyds   
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The reports of $1000 range come from the first 200 struck which were struck more than once and in satin. I think the asking price of 1k is way high and those owners will never see it.
That figure was spouted by a very enthusiastic purchaser but not necessarily supported by the realistic numismatists. Personally, if someone offered a grand for mine I'd accept but I just don't truthfully believe it would ever happen.

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$ilverHawk   
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" The term shall not include any re-issue or re-strike of any original numismatic item by the United States or any foreign government."

 

All you would have to do is legally become a foreign government and then you could mint 1964-D Peace Dollars to your hearts content :devil:

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