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Clad layer
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Started by Hoghead515,

27 posts in this topic

Hoghead515

Hoghead515

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Posted

We were out working away from home and stopped at a store. My friend got some change back and we was looking thru all of it once we were outside. I noticed a quarter he got back had a funny ring to it when it was dropped in the other change. I looked and noticed it looked like it only had half a clad layer. He sent it home with me for more investigation. Is it possible for only half a clad layer to be missing?Polish_20210817_180751909.jpg.c088f4d33914cf450554bcd8a249b7db.jpgPolish_20210817_180648591.thumb.jpg.058ab228c8f9e0cb52e845d9c2fe4a90.jpg

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Hoghead515

Hoghead515

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On 8/17/2021 at 6:48 PM, Quintus Arrius said:

Ohh-kay,... now what? You were short-changed. You were robbed!  I would set it aside...

Its not mine. Gotta give it back to my coworker. Just checking it out. 

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Hoghead515

Hoghead515

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On 8/17/2021 at 7:01 PM, Quintus Arrius said:

He ought to set it aside. 🐓

Be a good one to put in a flip if its the real deal. The weight is what has me wondering. 

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Just Bob

Just Bob

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On 8/17/2021 at 6:10 PM, Quintus Arrius said:

Anyone know if this coin lies within the "tolerance limits" as mentioned in a similar, older thread for heavyweights?

Tolerance is .227, so the acceptable average weight is 5.44 to 5.90, rounded to two decimal places.

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Conder101

Conder101

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A clad layer weighs about .91 grams so a quarter missing a clad layer would weigh 4.76 grams.  When you make allowance for tolerance a weight of 4.62 grams fits very nicely for a missing clad layer coin.  I would say it's the real deal.

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Hoghead515

Hoghead515

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Thank you all for the replies. I told him about all the replies. He is very happy. I kinda figured it was the real deal when i was inspecting it. Due to the look and weight. Also the ring it makes when it lightly bumps other change. We couldnt match the sound with a regular clad coin. Thank you friends. 

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Hoghead515

Hoghead515

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On 8/19/2021 at 10:38 PM, VKurtB said:

Single sided is the NORMAL way to find missing clad layers. Why would both sides be missing? When I see both missing, I am instantly suspicious. 

I just didnt know much about them. I didnt know exactly how the clad layer is put on them. And how the cause would come about. I think im gonna do some research on it and try to learn the exact process. 

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Henri Charriere

Henri Charriere

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I Would love to hear from @cladkingweigh in on this. I've got a feeling, if anyone knows, he knows.  I know no one more passionate of these underappreciared innovations than he does.   🐓

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Oldhoopster

Oldhoopster

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On 12/16/2021 at 4:08 PM, Quintus Arrius said:

I Would love to hear from @cladkingweigh in on this. I've got a feeling, if anyone knows, he knows.  I know no one more passionate of these underappreciared innovations than he does.   🐓

Clad king has posted quite a bit here and on other sites regarding clad coinage.  He is very knowledgeable of the availability/survivability of high grade examples, and is a great resource.  However I can't recall him posting much, if anything, on error coins.

Why do you you think he would be a better error resource than conder or vkurt? 

BTW - I thought conder's post had excellent information.

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VKurtB

VKurtB

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On 12/16/2021 at 4:05 PM, Oldhoopster said:

Clad king has posted quite a bit here and on other sites regarding clad coinage.  He is very knowledgeable of the availability/survivability of high grade examples, and is a great resource.  However I can't recall him posting much, if anything, on error coins.

Why do you you think he would be a better error resource than conder or vkurt? 

BTW - I thought conder's post had excellent information.

I am NOT much of a source for errors. I just recall most of what I have read. I don’t remember where or who as much as what I read. This really cranks up the “link please” crowd. I don’t care. It’s like my career as an election administrator. I write things and people ask me the source. “I am the stinking source. I was there and did it. Most of the best knowledge ain’t on the Internet.”

Edited by VKurtB
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RWB

RWB

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Clad coins are only sampled for weight, so under- and overweight coins are not unusual. The bulk coinage stock is supplied in large rolls so a manufacturing defect might go unnoticed at the mint.

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Henri Charriere

Henri Charriere

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@Oldhoopster

I had a feeling that was you peering over my shoulder.  Dena's watching too, so I will be cautious in my words...

 Simply put, you go to the source. There is no way you see 🐓, , and not think, Q.A.; likewise one cannot be tempted to think basketball and not consider @oldhoopser.

Twenty-four reples have been elicited; I accept some and gloss over others. Now I would like to hear from @cladking.  If he claims "errors" are not his area of expertise, so be it.  Personally, I fail to see how this could have happened.  I am not interested in WHAT happend;  I want know WHY.  P.S. This is not to impugn the replies of others. (However, my only "complaint," however  unremarkable it may appear be is: I WOULD HAVE LIKED TO SEE THE EDGE.  After all, wasn't that the point of the posting?

Edited by Quintus Arrius
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Henri Charriere

Henri Charriere

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On 12/16/2021 at 11:19 PM, Quintus Arrius said:

@Oldhoopster

I had a feeling that was you peering over my shoulder.  Dena's watching too, so I will be cautious in my words...

 Simply put, you go to the source. There is no way you see 🐓, , and not think, Q.A.; likewise one cannot be tempted to think basketball and not consider @oldhoopser.

Twenty-four reples have been elicited; I accept some and gloss over others. Now I would like to hear from @cladking.  If he claims "errors" are not his area of expertise, so be it.  Personally, I fail to see how this could have happened.  I am not interested in WHAT happend;  I want know WHY.  P.S. This is not to impugn the replies of others. (However, my only "complaint," however  unremarkable it may appear be is: I WOULD HAVE LIKED TO SEE THE EDGE.  After all, wasn't that the point of the posting?

Die polishing: possible water damage. 

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Conder101

Conder101

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On 8/20/2021 at 4:23 PM, Hoghead515 said:

I didnt know exactly how the clad layer is put on them.

There have been two different methods.  Both involved three ingots of metal, the two outer CuNi layers and the copper center.  In both cases the surfaces of the ingots that would be in contact with each other would be ground flat and smooth the idea being that the surfaces should be in as close contact with each other as possible no irregularities, no bumps, no voids.  Originally the ingots would then be bonded together using explosive bonding.  Explosives would be placed top and bottom and detonated with the force of the explosion welding the pieces of metal together and then the welded ingot would then be rolled into strip. This was one of the reasons the clad material was chosen.  It was an anticounterfeiting feature.  It was felt that counterfeiters would not be able to do the explosive bonding.

Later rather than using explosive they just used very high pressure rolling to bond the three layers together and then to roll it on out into strip.

If you google explosive bonding or explosive welding you can find some good explanations and a couple of videos that demonstrate the technique.

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