Thank You thread 2 2

[Hoghead515]

I just wanted to give a shout out and a thank you to all the members who take the time to help us.  I am truly grateful and look up to you all very much. You don't have to take the time to help us but you do it anyway. I'm truly blessed and honored to have met such a great group of friends. I take the help you have given me to heart and I will never forget it. I'm sure there's several more who feel the same as I do. Hope everyone of you have a wonderful day and if there's any way I can ever help you I'd be honored to. 

[Henri Charriere]

Alright, alright Hoghead.  Now that Bernie Madoff has passed away, I will tell you exactly where he hid his great gold and silver hoard. Not because it did not contain Roosters but because you are still young enough and strong enough and probably have access to the equipment you will need to move all that heavy bar bullion. I would imagine his holdings make Binion's hoard comparable to an oversized petty cash box. Don't laugh, literally millions are unaccounted for.  😉

Edited April 15, 2021 by Quintus Arrius
Missing letter.

[Hoghead515]

11 minutes ago, Quintus Arrius said:

Alright, alright Hoghead.  Now that Bernie Madoff has passed away, I will tell you exactly where he hid his great gold and silver hoard. Not because it did not contain Roosters but because you are still young enough and strong enough and probably have access to the equipment you will need to move all that heavy bar bullion. I would imagine his holdings make Binion's hoard comparable to an oversized petty cash box. Don't laugh, literally millions are unaccounted for.  😉

I'd sure like to dig up a hoard somewhere. If a person ever did though the government would probably find a reason to take it. 

[Henri Charriere]

Just now, Hoghead515 said:

I'd sure like to dig up a hoard somewhere. If a person ever did though the government would probably find a reason to take it. 

True indeed!

[GoldFinger1969]

My firm actually vetted managers and we had Madoff on our list.  We never used him.

[World Colonial]

4 hours ago, GoldFinger1969 said:

My firm actually vetted managers and we had Madoff on our list.  We never used him.

That was close

[GoldFinger1969]

1 hour ago, World Colonial said:

That was close

Not really.....we got pestered all the time by some clients to admit him so they could probably invest with him through the Private Bank.  We had 3 guys with MBAs scouting them and then the PMs like me (with CFAs) reviewing that.

Ultimately, we couldn't figure out HOW Madoff made his money (is he buying small caps or large caps ?  We needed to know) and he had no succession plan, with only him managing the entiere account (what happens if he gets hit by a bus ?  Who takes over ?).

Had we even elected to take him on, I have to think that him self-clearing would have been a huge red flag.  That's the tell-tale signal of a fraud.  You always want your statements/trades to be done under the supervision of a big Wall Street firm like JP Morgan Chase or Morgan Stanley or Goldman Sachs. 

They are on the hook then if there's any fraud.

[RWB]

22 hours ago, Hoghead515 said:

 If a person ever did though the government would probably find a reason to take it. 

The U.S. government does not get involved in hoards, buried treasure or other finds. That is a property matter for local and state law. Shipwrecks get really complicated, though. Most other countries have laws covering "finds." Usually the finder and an antiquities agency divide the value; but, property and land laws are different in the US than in other countries.

[World Colonial]

12 hours ago, GoldFinger1969 said:

Not really.....we got pestered all the time by some clients to admit him so they could probably invest with him through the Private Bank.  We had 3 guys with MBAs scouting them and then the PMs like me (with CFAs) reviewing that.

Ultimately, we couldn't figure out HOW Madoff made his money (is he buying small caps or large caps ?  We needed to know) and he had no succession plan, with only him managing the entiere account (what happens if he gets hit by a bus ?  Who takes over ?).

Had we even elected to take him on, I have to think that him self-clearing would have been a huge red flag.  That's the tell-tale signal of a fraud.  You always want your statements/trades to be done under the supervision of a big Wall Street firm like JP Morgan Chase or Morgan Stanley or Goldman Sachs. 

They are on the hook then if there's any fraud.

I was being sarcastic.

When someone is running a Ponzi scheme, no succession plan required.  No segregation of duties either and you don't take vacations so someone else can look at the records.

[Hoghead515]

I guess old Madoff died either yesterday or this morning didn't he?  Heard on the radio. 

[GoldFinger1969]

2 hours ago, World Colonial said:

I was being sarcastic.

I know. 

2 hours ago, World Colonial said:

When someone is running a Ponzi scheme, no succession plan required.  No segregation of duties either and you don't take vacations so someone else can look at the records.

There are actually money managers who are basically The Firm when it comes to decision-making.  They have really junior people, very young, not much experience and minimal credentials....helping them.  Again, it's not a problem because we'll lose money if the guy croaks, but if he or she does.....then we can't keep the money there if we like their investment style.

A good example of a succession plan is Al Frank, a former newsletter writer who died years ago, having a much younger guy as his right-hand man running things alongside him.  When Frank died, the assistant took over and the firm has survived and even thrived.  

I always thought it strange that neither of Madoff's sons, nor any other relative, worked alongside him.  THAT is unheard of in the business -- you don't have your family members in the mail room or taking phone calls.  

Edited April 16, 2021 by GoldFinger1969

[Henri Charriere]

I wanted to make a few remarks about the decedent's wife, but I will gladly dispense with them.  Not because anyone would insist we get Back on Track, this being Hoghead515's thread, but to take this opportunity to let him know how much I appreciate his warm bedside manner and down-to-earth comments.  No pretentiousness.  What you see is what you get.  No dramatic departures or earth-shaking revelations.  I do not believe HH has it in him to lie, misrepresent or exaggerate. Instead of thanking us, HH, we should be thanking you. And I for one appreciate your down-home honesty. You are a credit to all, old and new alike.

Edited April 17, 2021 by Quintus Arrius
Change deceased to decedent's

[Hoghead515]

1 hour ago, Quintus Arrius said:

I wanted to make a few remarks about the deceased wife, but I will gladly dispense with them.  Not because anyone would insist we get Back on Track, this being Hoghead515's thread, but to take this opportunity to let him know how much I appreciate his warm bedside manner and down-to-earth comments.  No pretentiousness.  What you see is what you get.  No dramatic departures or earth-shaking revelations.  I do not believe HH has it in him to lie, misrepresent or exaggerate. Instead of thanking us, HH, we should be thanking you. And I for one appreciate your down-home honesty. You are a credit to all, old and new alike.

Thank you for the kind words my good friend. I really appreciate it. 

[GoldFinger1969]

5 hours ago, RWB said:

The U.S. government does not get involved in hoards, buried treasure or other finds. That is a property matter for local and state law. Shipwrecks get really complicated, though. Most other countries have laws covering "finds." Usually the finder and an antiquities agency divide the value; but, property and land laws are different in the US than in other countries.

Yes, I believe with the SS Central America that the insurance companies which paid out 100+ years ago got a small %.  Or their successor companies.

Edited April 16, 2021 by GoldFinger1969

[Walkerfan]

@Hoghead515Thank you for your genuine appreciation and sincerity.  I try to help, as much as I can, but I still LEARN a lot, too.  You seem like you'd be a great person to have a beer with.  Thanks, for being you and for making this site a much better place for ALL.  

Edited April 16, 2021 by Walkerfan

[Henri Charriere]

2 hours ago, GoldFinger1969 said:

Yes, I believe with the SS Central America that the insurance companies which paid out 100+ years ago got a small %.  Or their successor companies.

True, there was an arrangement made to accommodate them.  As you know, Monarch's strategy was to market the gold as genuine California gold rush dust, granules, nuggets, coins and bars as being of incontestable provenance.  I was dismayed to learn that one of the principals cheated the investors and was sentenced to a Federal term of imprisonment for contempt.

Unlike Mel Fisher who looted shipwrecked sites willy-nilly, this expedition took great pains to note the exact position gold was taken from. The find broadened our knowledge of gold considerably and even merited a dedicated section of its own in the Red Book with updated populations, prices and the names of assayers hitherto unknown to numismatists. My secret unrealistic dream was to acquire the so-called Eureka silver bar.

[Hoghead515]

46 minutes ago, Walkerfan said:

@Hoghead515Thank you for your genuine appreciation and sincerity.  I try to help, as much as I can, but I still LEARN a lot, too.  You seem like you'd be a great person to have a beer with.  Thanks, for being you and for making this site a much better place for ALL.  

Thank you to my friend. You never know.  One of these days we may run into each other in this small world and have a cold beer. 

[Walkerfan]

8 minutes ago, Hoghead515 said:

Thank you to my friend. You never know.  One of these days we may run into each other in this small world and have a cold beer. 

You're welcome and it would be my pleasure.  

Edited April 17, 2021 by Walkerfan

[Just Bob]

Boy, this thread really got hijacked.  

To The Hogster: it is a pleasure to have you on board with us. 

[Hoghead515]

18 minutes ago, Just Bob said:

Boy, this thread really got hijacked.  

To The Hogster: it is a pleasure to have you on board with us. 

Thank you my friend. I have learned a whole lot from you all. Sometimes I don't comment on alot of threads but I read them and use that knowledge.  There's no way I could have ever learned most of the things I have if I wouldn't have joined this forum. I would have still been watching YouTube videos and saving MD coins. I learned a whole lot and now may be able to help someone else if they ever need it or teach my kids and grandkids what I learned.  I learn something ever single day off here. There is way more to this hobby than I ever dreamed. 

[numisport]

Here's another disgusting fact about Bernie's money. He was a huge political donor. Don't you think the Clintons and the Obamas should return that money to settle the case 😒

Edited April 17, 2021 by numisport

[Hoghead515]

7 hours ago, numisport said:

Here's another disgusting fact about Bernie's money. He was a huge political donor. Don't you think the Clintons and the Obamas should return that money to settle the case 😒

Imagine if that donation would have went somewhere else. Be the awfullest bunch of cane raised ever. 

[GoldFinger1969]

8 hours ago, numisport said:

Here's another disgusting fact about Bernie's money. He was a huge political donor. Don't you think the Clintons and the Obamas should return that money to settle the case 😒

No, it's "travelled" too far from the primary investment account.  Should the grocer who took Bernie's money also be held liable ?

You have to draw the line somewhere.  

Had the SEC been more dilligent on outright FRAUD and not on nebulous "insider trading" actions against hedge funds and private individuals, Madoff would have been caught much much earlier. 

I mean, a 3-man accounting firm auditing a $20 billion money manager ?  Self-clearing ?  I mean, next to saying that their banking funds were checked and cleared by folks in Bulgaria and Nigeria, I don't know how many more red flags the SEC needed.

Edited April 17, 2021 by GoldFinger1969

[Hoghead515]

If it would have been me and I got a donation from someone like that I would make it public and turn in what money they gave me. Would make it clear to people I don't deal with people like that. My good word to people, conscience, and honesty is worth more than all the money in the world. I'd rather be broke then know I accepted dirty money. That's just me tho. I couldn't sleep at night knowing the good Lord was looking down on me for keeping that money knowing it was dirty. May be why I'm poor now but I got a clear conscience, a place to lay my head, and some of the most wonderful friends and family ever. And that's worth more than any amount of dirty money there is. For an example if someone robbed a bank and donated 20,000 to me and I found out I would turn the money back in. Them keeping that donated money from him is the same thing as receiving stolen property. I think politicians should be held to the same standards as us. Higher standards actually. No matter what side of the isle they are on.