Im deleting my PCGS Account and never going back
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238 posts in this topic

If you have the time and the money, I suggest going to the ANA's grading course at summer seminar. You and all the other YNs can learn the ropes on grading and hopefully avoid another sad experience like this. You could also just take 4 points off what you think the coin would grade to get an accurate grade. 

Most coins I look at graded have 0 marks at 65, 1 or 2 barely noticeable marks at the most, after that it is all eye appeal and market grading. Grading until uncirculated is textbook, after that, experience is the only way to learn. 

The majority of dealers I communicate with regard PCGS with a higher esteem than NGC, and bluesheet prices mirror this. Maybe that "TPG" you cracked the coin out of was probably just an SGS or PCI holder.

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I have no interest in becoming a coin grader, I think they should be eliminated and computer grading would be a viable option. If a TPG is consistently scoring mashed up coins at MS63 there is no reason why you would give my minimum MS64 coin a MS63 grade especially if I'm paying you for the Service.

Coin dealers work on small margins and there IS NO REASON SENDING IN A PQ COIN should get you a Minimum Score, I'm sorry but they are wrong. Extremely wrong. I've already emailed PCGS and requested all my money back and stated my 

case. I will not use their service and I will urge others to do the same. The phone Number is off the hook, there is no email support, people over there probably laugh if you have a comment or question about your coin. If your going to run a terrible company terribly, expect there to be a target on your back !

 

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Here's one of my Tidy House Monster Toners. This one has some bag marks and got an MS63 also. I also own a comparable MS63 STAR from NGC that looks like it was hit with a Makita drill and a hand chisel and was left in a walking coin hip bag. It is so bad it's not even funny. Where does it end grouping everything together ? This one has more Luster than my MS63 Star, it almost blinds you but no dice again. I believe its graded correctly at MS63 and CAC already green beaned me for this one but what happens when you grade other MS61 coins as MS63, you take me out of the game. I can keep going with other examples.....into next week I'm just starting haven't even got to my MS66+ yet

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Edited by NevadaS&G
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54 minutes ago, Morpheus1967 said:

Well I just talked to PCGS.  They don't want to grade any more of your coins either.  So there you go.  

Because they can't grade and they Suck Period ! I just sent a Company 500 USD for worthless Plastic Wrapper and a grade that means nothing. 

Edited by NevadaS&G
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NevadaS&G is merely divulging a truth the vast majority of viewers find makes them uncomfortable.  In one of my earliest posts, the venerable VKurtB mocked me for complaining about the fees charged by a TPGS I did not identify by name: PCGS.  One viewer recognizing the futility of defending the indefensible, dismissively wrote me off:  "Life is unfair. Get over it!"  It seems the beef here aired by the OP has struck a sensitive nerve with those too intimidated by offending the overseers to speak up. 

I myself have provided photos of a coin (above a post or two) to illustrate a point made by Alex of PA which suggests the ring of truth. I purposely withheld both the grade and TPGS which assigned it.  So far, no one wants to take a stab at it. Not even MAULEMALL who seemingly condes cendingly intimates he knows more about grading while urging the OP move on to less challenging pursuits. Unspoken throughout the ongoing thread are thoughts such as, What if I were to submit my coin to NGC? What grade would I expect to get?  What if I were to submit the same coin to PCGS?  What grade would Iexpect to get?  Now, the hard part:  What if my NGC graded coin were sent to PCGS for cross-grading? Or the reverse: what if my PCGS graded coin were sent to NGC for cross-grading?  Both have declared in their submission forms they would NOT render a higher grade, presumably however deserving.  As soon as I have gotten a grade from a viewer here, I will share with you, the rank amateur novice and chief numismatist/grading finalizer alike, the contents of a cryptic note I received regarding the grade that was ultimately rendered. There is merit to NS&G's complaint.

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[I still cannot fathom the blatant hostility leveled at the OP, still a relative newcomer with a smattering of posts -- and a compelling desire to share his grievance with the membership at large. Since not a one of you dared stick his neck out to venture a guess as to the condition "assigned" to my coin, the "upright, unblemished and without sin" 1909 Rooster, I will take the liberty of sharing with similarly disgruntled former members of PCGS three things I felt was a turn-off.  Firstly, automatic re-subscription to the service at its highest tier necessarily denying me that choice upon reflection and forcing me to jump thru unsubscribe hoops to accomplish same.  Secondly, producing a submission form which rivals the IRS in unnecessary complexity including a gratuitous additional charge based on the fair market value of a coin which very often has not been determined or is out of date. And thirdly, arbitrarily cancelling a grading credit, without notice and/or consultation prior to one's subscription expiration.  (Interested parties who want to play "Grader for a Day" are still welcome to make their assessment providing any substantiation, for or against, as they feel is warranted (on my coin which has since migrated mid-thread to page 2 of this post.)]

Edited by Quintus Arrius
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56 minutes ago, Morpheus1967 said:

Lol service failures?  You paid for grading, they graded them.  That's like asking for your money back in Vegas when you take a hit on fifteen and get a face card, all the while the dealer was showing a 6. 

 

And honestly?  Why don't you go complain about it on their board and see how far that gets you? 

Apparently you can't read and jump to conclusions. I stated that I paid Express Service for one coin which is 5 Days. Turnaround time was 30 Days. The coin was Inaccurately Graded. I have sent PCGS Numerous Emails regarding this matter this morning, last week, a month ago, as usual no response from the chickens. They must be in hiding.

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1 hour ago, Quintus Arrius said:

[I still cannot fathom the blatant hostility leveled at the OP, still a relative newcomer with a smattering of posts -- and a compelling desire to share his grievance with the membership at large. Since not a one of you dared stick his neck out to venture a guess as to the condition "assigned" to my coin, the "upright, unblemished and without sin" 1909 Rooster, I will take the liberty of sharing with similarly disgruntled former members of PCGS three things I felt was a turn-off.  Firstly, automatic re-subscription to the service at its highest tier necessarily denying me that choice upon reflection and forcing me to jump thru unsubscribe hoops to accomplish same.  Secondly, producing a submission form which rivals the IRS in unnecessary complexity including a gratuitous additional charge based on the fair market value of a coin which very often has not been determined or is out of date. And thirdly, arbitrarily cancelling a grading credit, without notice and/or consultation prior to one's subscription expiration.  (Interested parties who want to play "Grader for a Day" are still welcome to make their assessment providing any substantiation, for or against, as they feel is warranted (on my coin which has since migrated mid-thread to page 2 of this post.)]

Im no grader by no means. Im very new collector. I just want to take a stab at it. Im very unexperienced so don't hold it against me. Im gonna say ms 65

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1 hour ago, NevadaS&G said:

Apparently you can't read and jump to conclusions. I stated that I paid Express Service for one coin which is 5 Days. Turnaround time was 30 Days. The coin was Inaccurately Graded. I have sent PCGS Numerous Emails regarding this matter this morning, last week, a month ago, as usual no response from the chickens. They must be in hiding.

Turnaround times are not guaranteed. They are estimates. 

FYI, last time an Express too around a month (on a very common coin) I complained and they gave me a free Express submissions. And BTW, after taking a month they undergraded the coin by a point in my opinion (and the opinion of NGC after I sent it to them).

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I just sent a Walking Liberty in AU58 condition to NGC along with some other coins. Will I get mad at NGC for grading it an AU55 or even an AU50 or Cleaned, of course not because I still think actual people work here who are capable of grading. My beef is with the people across the street as I know who they are and what they do. I am not trying to start a War or any Rivalry. I trust what the graders say at NGC entirely. All 10 of my Coins are getting cracked from New Holders and sent to Florida

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1 hour ago, Hoghead515 said:

Im no grader by no means. Im very new collector. I just want to take a stab at it. Im very unexperienced so don't hold it against me. Im gonna say ms 65

I’m not at all familiar with those coins, but my guess is MS63. That’s due to the discoloration on the cheek and neck, the marks on the lower right part of the neck and upper left portion of the cap, the marks beneath and to the left of the rooster, the marks on the left wing and the marks behind its neck and head. That said, the pictures aren’t very clear. And for all I know, the coin could have rub/be AU and/or have altered surfaces.

Regardless of how it was graded by PCGS, NGC or anyone else, that says nothing about the validity of the thread originator’s complaints.

Edited by MarkFeld
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1 hour ago, MarkFeld said:

I’m not at all familiar with those coins, but my guess is MS63. That’s due to the discoloration on the cheek and neck, the marks on the lower right part of the neck and upper left portion of the cap, the marks beneath and to the left of the rooster, the marks on the left wing and the marks behind its neck and head. That said, the pictures aren’t very clear. And for all I know, the coin could have rub/be AU and/or have altered surfaces.

Regardless of how it was graded by PCGS, NGC or anyone else, that says nothing about the validity of the thread originator’s complaints.

Very lousy pictures to grade from. The obverse picture is so bright that it could easily be hiding a ton of marks. The discoloration on the neck (and ribbon on same horizontal line from it) are chips in the die that gave this coin a raised area. I suspect the mark behind the neck is die polish which is common to run 12:00 to 6:00 on these coins.

Based on what I can see, I'd guess PCGS graded it MS66. 

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13 minutes ago, gmarguli said:

Very lousy pictures to grade from. The obverse picture is so bright that it could easily be hiding a ton of marks. The discoloration on the neck (and ribbon on same horizontal line from it) are chips in the die that gave this coin a raised area. I suspect the mark behind the neck is die polish which is common to run 12:00 to 6:00 on these coins.

Based on what I can see, I'd guess PCGS graded it MS66. 

So we see it precisely the same.😄 
But seriously, I’m glad you posted, as I figured you had probably handled them. 

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5 hours ago, Alex in PA. said:

There's no hostility towards this person.  Did the OP take his complaint to the CU Forum - NO!  Did the OP file a complaint with PCGS - NO!  The OP brought his grievance into our house avoiding any contact with PCGS or their Forum.  Why?  You have an untold number of his comments dissing PCGS, their graders and all Californians to boot.  Those are the actions of a blow hard looking to stir up troubles and those troubles could cause a grievance between this Forum and CU like in 2003 and 2004.  The OP needs to accept responsibility and deal directly with PCGS instead of involving our forum and stop being a cry baby about this.    

Alex, my dear friend Alex. The gentleman has stated repeatedly all good-faith attempts to communicate with them have failed.  He is relatively new here, he is clearly upset, and out a comparatively large sum of money considering his expectations and actual results.  (We've had two other members unload here recently; I am very interested in what each has to say because there is a grain of truth to each and none of us have emerged unscathed in the TPGS juggernauts.)  We should encourage all comers.  None of us are infallible and immune to being taken advantage of. I like to hear people out.

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5 hours ago, NevadaS&G said:

Update: I successfully charged back the entire amount sans the 69 dollar Membership fee. They can keep that and go to Greece. Thread Closed Again !

Thread closed? Already? You just got here! Do drop in from time to time...

Edited by Quintus Arrius
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