US Type: What to Include? 0

[LINCOLNMAN]

I'm just starting on 18th century non-gold. I've decided to include both the 2-leaves and 3-leaves FH dollar varieties. After looking at the reverse designs it seems to me that they are sufficiently different to merit including them both, although only one FH example is "traditional". Conversely, at one point I had decided not to include the No-Drapery LS variety as I had focused only on the drapery. Of course, the overall obverse designs are markedly different, so they are now in my set. 

Always open to suggestions: what are your thoughts as to what to leave in or out, compared to the more traditional US federal types (all centuries)? 

[MarkFeld]

My suggestion is to do entirely as YOU please with YOUR set. 

[LINCOLNMAN]

8 minutes ago, MarkFeld said:

My suggestion is to do entirely as YOU please with YOUR set. 

Sure, but I don't have deep knowledge of all series. I wasn't going to include both FH dollar varieties until I read about and saw the clear differences. I don't know what I don't know. 

[RWB]

40 minutes ago, MarkFeld said:

My suggestion is to do entirely as YOU please with YOUR set. 

I agree with Mark.

Select designs that appeal to you (and you budget). Focus on designs that illustrate the variety and evolution of US coinage. If you start with radical changes first, such as flowing hair, bust, turban, then seated halves, you can always back-fill with less obvious design changes as your experience and knowledge increase. Learning about each design - both the mythology and reality - will enhance your appreciation and enjoyment of the hobby and American history.

Just a thought or two.

 

Edited November 24, 2019 by RWB
typo

[MarkFeld]

1 minute ago, RWB said:

I agree with Mark.

Select designs that appeal to you (and you budget). Focus on designs that illustrate the variety and evolution of US coinage. If you start with radical changes first, such as flowing hair, bust, turban, then seated halves, you can always back-fill with less obvious design changes as your experience and knowledge increase. Learning about each designs - both the mythology and reality - will enhance your appreciation and enjoyment of the hobby and American history.

Just a thought or two.

 

That sounds like great advice to me.

[LINCOLNMAN]

Excellent advice you two and I appreciate it, but I was looking for series-specific knowledge more than advice. Although, I have to admit that was also trying to stimulate some conversation around matters of taste. This place is pretty quiet - reminds me of a junior high school dance most of the time. 

[kbbpll]

I mostly stand up against the wall at this jr high dance. Pursuing series-specific knowledge can be fun but also daunting. For example, most type collectors are satisfied with one Barber dime, quarter, and half. But if you really want all the design types, you've got two obverse and three reverse designs for the Barber dime, two obverse and three reverse types for the quarter, and two obverse types for the half. If you really wanted all types by year and mint, there are so many transition varieties in the Barbers that you would need dozens of coins. It's fun to dig into a particular series but everyone has to draw their own line somewhere.

[LINCOLNMAN]

13 minutes ago, kbbpll said:

I mostly stand up against the wall at this jr high dance. Pursuing series-specific knowledge can be fun but also daunting. For example, most type collectors are satisfied with one Barber dime, quarter, and half. But if you really want all the design types, you've got two obverse and three reverse designs for the Barber dime, two obverse and three reverse types for the quarter, and two obverse types for the half. If you really wanted all types by year and mint, there are so many transition varieties in the Barbers that you would need dozens of coins. It's fun to dig into a particular series but everyone has to draw their own line somewhere.

Good stuff. Can you elaborate, say just on the Barber dimes ( I have one only) to get rolling? 

[MarkFeld]

You already know something about and can easily learn more, regarding what constitutes types and varieties. 

Information is easily accessible in sources such as the Red book, various population reports, registry set websites, etc.

Ultimately, it’s up to you what you feel is important and/or desirable to include in your set.

[kbbpll]

10 minutes ago, LINCOLNMAN said:

Good stuff. Can you elaborate, say just on the Barber dimes ( I have one only) to get rolling? 

People are probably getting bored with me hyping the Barbers, but here are a couple posts about the dime types. You could easily obtain all 3 reverses and both obverses. (Hmm, the links are showing up as "pictures" - haven't seen that on here before. New feature?)

 

[LINCOLNMAN]

2 minutes ago, MarkFeld said:

You already know something about and can easily learn more, regarding what constitutes types and varieties. 

Information is easily accessible in sources such as the Red book, various population reports, registry set websites, etc.

Ultimately, it’s up to you what you feel is important and/or desirable to include in your set.

Mark, this forum is also a source, or should be IMO. As many times as I've looked at the Redbook, pop reports, or the like I had no clue that there are as many possible varieties of Barber coins (see above)  - for example. 

[LINCOLNMAN]

6 minutes ago, kbbpll said:

People are probably getting bored with me hyping the Barbers, but here are a couple posts about the dime types. You could easily obtain all 3 reverses and both obverses. (Hmm, the links are showing up as "pictures" - haven't seen that on here before. New feature?)

 

Just what I was looking for, thank you. The difference in the leaves is really quite striking, to me worthy of treatment as a separate "type". 

[kbbpll]

This kind of "type" collecting is vast. 1932-1972 Washington quarters have 3 obverses and 8 reverses, according to Cherrypickers and CONECA.

[MarkFeld]

2 hours ago, LINCOLNMAN said:

Mark, this forum is also a source, or should be IMO. As many times as I've looked at the Redbook, pop reports, or the like I had no clue that there are as many possible varieties of Barber coins (see above)  - for example. 

Glad to see you got some of the type of information you’re seeking.

[World Colonial]

If I were to opt for a US type set, it would exclude a lot of coins considered as "necessary" for a "complete" set.  Most of the differences are minor and more than a few of these coins are (very) expensive because  many collectors allow their collection to be defined for them by some book or album.

The first coin I would eliminate is the 1879 Flowing Hair Stella.  It's actually a common pattern.

[Conder101]

On 11/24/2019 at 10:14 AM, LINCOLNMAN said:

I wasn't going to include both FH dollar varieties until I read about and saw the clear differences.

You have to remember when dealing with pre-1836 US coinage that every die is different and sometimes there can be significant differences within the same general style or even year.  How different they have to be before you decide to include it as a different "type" is up to you.  

In the Draped bust cents there are at least four different major rev types

Rev of 94 first type  (easy identification point is right branch ends in double leaf single leaves above ONE, double leaf below O in OF)

Rev of 94 second type (easy identification right branch ends in double leaf, single leaves above ONE, triple leaf cluster below OF)

Rev of 95 (easy identification right branch ends in single leaf)

Rev of 97 (easy identification right branch end in close double leaf, double leaves above ONE, three leaf cluster below O in OF)

All four of these reverse show are from one year, 1796 draped bust cent.

Edited November 28, 2019 by Conder101

[LINCOLNMAN]

On 11/28/2019 at 11:10 AM, Conder101 said:

You have to remember when dealing with pre-1836 US coinage that every die is different and sometimes there can be significant differences within the same general style or even year.  How different they have to be before you decide to include it as a different "type" is up to you.  

In the Draped bust cents there are at least four different major rev types

Rev of 94 first type  (easy identification point is right branch ends in double leaf single leaves above ONE, double leaf below O in OF)

Rev of 94 second type (easy identification right branch ends in double leaf, single leaves above ONE, triple leaf cluster below OF)

Rev of 95 (easy identification right branch ends in single leaf)

Rev of 97 (easy identification right branch end in close double leaf, double leaves above ONE, three leaf cluster below O in OF)

All four of these reverse show are from one year, 1796 draped bust cent.

Many thanks. Some marked differences, just the sort of thing I was looking for.