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ASE PRICES FROM US MINT HIGHER THAN EBAY
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14 posts in this topic

So I was just looking for a ballpark value of my 2018 W ASE, got on eBay and found that the coin is selling for mid-$30 dollar range slabbed, and I paid almost $50.00 for it from the mint! So my assumption that ALL products will have the lowest price when bought from the mint is my own little cognitive fabrication. Besides my mind being weak, what would explain this pricing bit? Do they really charge that much more for the little box and COA??

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35 minutes ago, JEJ said:

So I was just looking for a ballpark value of my 2018 W ASE, got on eBay and found that the coin is selling for mid-$30 dollar range slabbed, and I paid almost $50.00 for it from the mint! So my assumption that ALL products will have the lowest price when bought from the mint is my own little cognitive fabrication. Besides my mind being weak, what would explain this pricing bit? Do they really charge that much more for the little box and COA??

The quick answer is "yes". For now, the secondary market is often cheaper, … unless it's not. And when it's not, it's waaaaaay not. The system is that 9 out of 10 mint products trade cheaper in the secondary market, but that 10th one will hurt you bad. So is the answer to wait and buy on the secondary market? Wellll, what if everyone did? Then there'd be no coins to have in the secondary market. "Ya pays yo money and ya takes yo chances."

The truth is that coins cost money to make, market, and sell. The secondary market does not have an obligation to give a profit to the original purchaser, but the original purchaser does have an obligation to cover any and all costs of producing those coins and sets. It's a hobby with a shrinking participation base, and this is what happens.

Edited by VKurtB
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Tnx for the reply. So can I assume that coins with unlimited mintage figures will be cheaper on secondary? It has also occurred to me that you will not find an error coin on the secondary market without a large premium?

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1 minute ago, JEJ said:

So can I assume that coins with unlimited mintage figures will be cheaper on secondary?

Overwhelmingly, yes. The exceptions to this are extremely few.

 

2 minutes ago, JEJ said:

It has also occurred to me that you will not find an error coin on the secondary market without a large premium?

It depends on what sort of coin and what sort of error. Most errors are quite moderate in value - not a way to make money, for sure. Only the very popular errors of very popular coin series warrant big money. Obviousness of the error is key. Most people here "waste their time" with USB digital microscopes (the quotes are because it is my deeply held opinion, with which some differ). The really valuable errors are as obvious as arterial bleeding.

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Yeah, really it's a matter of what you want to own. As a child collector I drooled over 1955 DDO Lincoln, and the 1972. Dream coins back then. Now I own them. I do enjoy our hobby. Thanks so much for your help Kurt!

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2 minutes ago, JEJ said:

Yeah, really it's a matter of what you want to own. As a child collector I drooled over 1955 DDO Lincoln, and the 1972. Dream coins back then. Now I own them. I do enjoy our hobby. Thanks so much for your help Kurt!

The problem with what I call the "newbie wave of roll hunting error searchers" is that they are NOT increasing the demand for the coins they are hunting. They just want to flip them for a quick buck, even when they are not true error coins. A look around eBay and especially Etsy will confirm that. All they are doing is adding SUPPLY, not demand, and that HAS TO (can't be any other way) actually DEPRESS the value of their finds. They are doing no good for themselves nor the hobby at large. Rather, they are unwittingly destroying the hobby.

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Good point, I have seen numerous questionable "error" coins for sale on eBay and at ridiculous prices. I think you're right about that digital microscope; no telling what you're gonna see at that level of magnification.

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What has always stuck with me on the original topic, is purchasing a 1971-S "brown box" Eisenhower directly from the mint in 1971 for $10. I still have it. 48 years later, you can easily buy one for $12-15 with shipping. $10 in 1971 is $63 today. You should only buy this stuff because you want it, not because you think it will be worth more later.

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15 hours ago, kbbpll said:

What has always stuck with me on the original topic, is purchasing a 1971-S "brown box" Eisenhower directly from the mint in 1971 for $10. I still have it. 48 years later, you can easily buy one for $12-15 with shipping. $10 in 1971 is $63 today. You should only buy this stuff because you want it, not because you think it will be worth more later.

Very great point.  Recently I purchased a collection of albums and with them came 2 books from 1965.  One to the effect of "appraising your collection" and the other a "green book" which was a price guide of sorts that included Canadian coins as well.  Anyhow, I routinely advise my son to purchase the coins he likes and the best version he can, but he's also 9 and when it comes to him blowing $40 at a coin show on junk silver or low grade common year indian heads then he's free to make those decisions on his own.  But back to the books, I had him grab his 2019 Red Book and I opened the 1965 Green Book and pulled up a website that would convert 1965 dollar amounts to current calculating for inflation & buying power.  After calling out most coins, telling him what they were listed for, what that amount is worth today, and having him compare it against current Red Book values the takeaway was that most simply followed the same trajectory.  Meaning they were not "great" investments, only that they held against inflation and didn't necessarily lose.  Anything gold actually outpaced inflation but that's most likely due to the relatively high price of gold bullion currently in place.  *adjusted for inflation, it's still lower than the peak in 1980* https://www.macrotrends.net/1333/historical-gold-prices-100-year-chart

Whenever he's tuned in to the research I like to take those little moments to help him build a better understanding of economy, cyclical events, and false conceptions.  Where somebody may look at a coin they've owned since 1955 and say, "Ya know, I paid $200 for that back then and I can sell it for $2,000 now.  That was a great investment!" but it's really not.  They just hedged inflation and missed out on investing that capital in something that may have outpaced and actually built wealth.

**I'm not saying there are no coins worthy of consideration as a great investment.  Similar to art as an investment, if there is a limited finite quantity and demand there will always be those uber rich interested in owning the best of the best.

Edited by CRAWTOMATIC
corrected a year
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12 hours ago, kbbpll said:

 You should only buy this stuff because you want it, not because you think it will be worth more later.

Definitely do this but I also would like to see my collection as a whole increase in value. Silver is up around 20% over the last year so I would expect to see my ASE selling for at least what I paid for it. And I consider that if someone has to buy from the producer of the goods, that they would have to charge more in a secondary market. But that is just not true in this case. Do they get a better price than I do from the mint. Obviously I want to spend as little as possible for the items I add to my collection, so I would like to understand how this works. If I pay $50 and then a year later (after the composition metal has risen 20% in price) I can buy it certified and slabbed (another expense to the secondary seller) for $35, I feel like I am missing an opportunity for a price break that I know nothing about. How do they get these items and such a low cost?

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2 hours ago, JEJ said:

 How do they get these items and such a low cost?

They don't get them from the mint at that much of a discount. They are either being sold at a loss by the buyer, or they are being sold by a dealer (or individual) who purchased them at a steep discount from someone who bought them from the mint, and, for some reason, had to sell them at a big loss.

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Ah, OK didn't think of that. Somebody liquidating grandpa's coin collection inheritance and taking the first offer from the dealer that is willing to buy the entire lot...

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On 10/23/2019 at 3:09 PM, JEJ said:

what would explain this pricing bit?

When they were sold by the mint, most every collector that wanted one bought one.  And a lot of them bought multiples so they could sell them to make the one they kept cheaper.  The problem is this means there are more coins than there are collectors interested in them.  In a situation like this prices fall.

On 10/24/2019 at 1:24 PM, JEJ said:

How do they get these items and such a low cost?

With more coins available than collectors, dealers know they are going to have their money tied up for a long time, so their offering prices are going to be LOW.  Now no one has to sell, but after getting several offers, and possibly having held the coins for awhile hoping they would go up, the seller finally gives up and takes what he can get even though it means taking a loss.

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