I finally added a few proof coins with the original Soho shells! 0

[coinsandmedals]

For those of you who read my other thread “International package issue”, the halfpenny pictured below is the coin that I was afraid went missing. This particular example is a proof halfpenny struck in copper by the Soho Mint (Peck 1371). The second coin pictured is an 1806 proof farthing (Peck-1391) that was also struck at the Soho Mint. Although both of these varieties are not nearly as rare as some their counterparts, they are somewhat unique. Matthew Boulton (the owner of the Soho Mint) took deep pride in the proof coins he produced and would often make tightly fitted pressed silver-lined brass cases (often called shells) to house them in. These particular coins have remained paired with their original shells for at least the last 200 years. It is exceedingly difficult to find specimens still paired with the original shells. Part of this is because, without the context of the coin, the shells are nondescript and have little meaning. However, when paired with the coin the shells attest to the detail and attention paid to producing some of the highest quality copper coinage England had ever seen in the 18th and 19th centuries. The Soho Mint was one of a kind and under the direction of Matthew Boulton forever impacted the way coins were produced. For more information about the Soho Mint, I encourage you to check out my registry set “What comes next? You’ve been freed. Do you know how hard it is to lead?”. This set aims to provide a glimpse into the rich history of the Soho Mint and serves as a source of information about the numerous pattern, proof, currency, and restrikes relevant to the Soho mint.

Both of these coins in be on their way to NGC Monday morning. It is my hope that NGC will be able to encapsulate the coins alongside the shells. I want to encapsulate the coins but I think it would be an absolute shame to separate them from their shells.

A few notes about the 1806 Halfpenny:

 At first glance, the picture might be somewhat confusing because it looks as though there are actually 4 shells as opposed to 2. This is not the case. I have simply included a picture of both sides of each shell to demonstrate what they look like. Most collectors are entirely unaware that these little pieces of brass exist, and as such, I wanted to take the opportunity to provide ample pictures.

I absolutely love every aspect of this coin expect one. Although only slightly distracting in hand, the spot behind George III’s head is really the sole distractor of an otherwise sharply struck and well-preserved example. The pictures do not accurately portray the highly reflective and deeply rich brown surfaces.

A few notes about the 1806 Farthing:

Unlike the halfpenny, there is not a single aspect that I find to be distracting. The coin is well struck with bold details and an even overall brown color. Although the pictures do not show it, the obverse and reverse are accented with blueish purple undertones. Overall this coin has some major eye appeal in hand. My pictures are horrible but it’s the best that I can do at the moment.

Edited September 20, 2019 by coinsandmedals

[ChrisH821]

Very cool! How do the shells hold closed? Does each half hold the edge of the coin or do they hold onto each other?

[coinsandmedals]

2 hours ago, ChrisH821 said:

Very cool! How do the shells hold closed? Does each half hold the edge of the coin or do they hold onto each other?

Good question! You hit the nail on the head. The two halves fit firmly against the edge of the coin. The pictures don’t do a good job portraying the dimensions, but the shells are just barely larger than the coins. 

[physics-fan3.14]

Did you talk to NGC about the shells before you sent them in? They might be able to accomodate you, but the multiholder which would best serve your needs has been discontinued for a long time. I really hope they're able to help you. 

[coinsandmedals]

7 minutes ago, physics-fan3.14 said:

Did you talk to NGC about the shells before you sent them in? They might be able to accomodate you, but the multiholder which would best serve your needs has been discontinued for a long time. I really hope they're able to help you. 

I haven’t sent them out yet, but I have been in contact with Mr. Heller. He has already proven to be extraordinarily helpful. Although I shouldn’t have expected anything less. The customer service alone is more than enough reason to keep coming back to NGC. 

[Conder101]

My understanding is the shells were NOT commonly made and mostly were only made for the pieces in his own and James Watt's personal collections.  Several years ago when the Boulton and Watt collections came on the market many of the pieces had the shells, but many of the new owners immediately sent the coins in for slabbing and just discarded the shells.  The shells were custom made for the individual coins so a shell for one coin typically will not fit a different one.  I consider the shells a unique item of Soho history, and a provenance item for the Boutlon and Watt collections.  It is a shame that so many of them have been thrown away.  I have two pieces from Boulton's collection and one from Watt's, unfortunately mine did not come with shells even though they came directly for the initial sales.

Edited September 21, 2019 by Conder101

[coinsandmedals]

For the most part, this is true; however, Peck (and maybe Doty?) specifically mentioned shipments of coins containing a small number of proof coins housed in these shells. I would agree that the majority of the pieces with the original shells likely did originate in either the Boulton or Watt family holdings. I was not provided provenance for these coins so I’ve erred on the side of caution. I contacted the seller to see if he has any additional information. I would love to be able to track these coins to either Boulton or Watt! 

You are absolutely correct, the shells are an extremely unique piece of Soho history. I only wish more had survived. It is sad to think of all the unique history that was lost when coins were separated from their shells. This is the reason that I will not consider having the coins encapsulated without the shells. I refuse to risk separating them. The whole point of submitting them is to preserve them together. 

3 hours ago, Conder101 said:

I have two pieces from Boulton's collection and one from Watt's, unfortunately mine did not come with shells even though they came directly for the initial sales.

Oh come on....it’s just mean to tease me like that. Do you have any pictures? 

[Just Bob]

Extremely cool!

[Jade Collection]

Wow this is very neat, too bad people got rid of the shells when submitting, what a shame!

[Conder101]

Unlike a lot of you folk I've never been driven to take pictures of my coins so I don't have images for you.

[Just Bob]

10 hours ago, Conder101 said:

Unlike a lot of you folk I've never been driven to take pictures of my coins so I don't have images for you.

Aww, I thought we were about to witness a chat board first-time event. 

[coinsandmedals]

16 minutes ago, Just Bob said:

Aww, I thought we were about to witness a chat board first-time event. 

You and I both. I was very hopeful. Can you provide us with the basic details Conder101? 

[Crawtomatic]

2 hours ago, coinsandmedals said:

You and I both. I was very hopeful. Can you provide us with the basic details Conder101? 

Small coin.  Reddish Brown in color.  I prefer to call it "August Rust" to be poetic.  Very unforgiving profile on the obverse.  Always use a down angle when you have that many chins.  Reverse has a lady in a wheelchair with a sheer linen dress on getting ready for her weekly sponge bath.

[coinsandmedals]

18 minutes ago, CRAWTOMATIC said:

Small coin.  Reddish Brown in color.  I prefer to call it "August Rust" to be poetic.  Very unforgiving profile on the obverse.  Always use a down angle when you have that many chins.  Reverse has a lady in a wheelchair with a sheer linen dress on getting ready for her weekly sponge bath.

Haha, I take it you do not find the design particularly appealing. I share your disposition but in relation to the vast majority of 20th century US coins. Take for instance Jefferson nickels, Washington quarters, and Franklin/Kennedy halves. I find all of those to be in my personal “take or leave” category.

Edited September 23, 2019 by coinsandmedals

[Crawtomatic]

7 minutes ago, coinsandmedals said:

Haha, I take it you do not find the design particularly appealing. I share your disposition but in relation to the vast majority of 20th century US coins. Take for instance Jefferson nickels, Washington quarters, and Franklin/Kennedy halves. I find all of those to be in my personal “take or leave” category.

haha Personally I do like the old designs of the UK half pennies and large pennies.  I was just being clever and the Brittannia reverse where she's seated always reminds me of an old-style wheelchair. 

[coinsandmedals]

35 minutes ago, CRAWTOMATIC said:

haha Personally I do like the old designs of the UK half pennies and large pennies.  I was just being clever and the Brittannia reverse where she's seated always reminds me of an old-style wheelchair. 

Haha now that you mention it, I can see where you are coming from. Your post made me chuckle. 

[coinsandmedals]

I mailed the coins off to NGC today along with 3 other invoices. The scheduled delivery date is this Thursday but I sent it registered so who knows when it will actually make it. I will be sure to update the thread when I find out more. 

[Conder101]

On 9/23/2019 at 2:52 PM, coinsandmedals said:

Can you provide us with the basic details Conder101?

Nothing too special, from Boulton I have a PF-62 (grades are my own opinion, the coins are raw) 1795 Hertfordshire 4, and a PF-61 1792 Warwickshire 389.  The Hertfordshire 4 was Boultons favorite token design and he had several that he used to show prospective clients the kind of quality work Soho could do.  The Warwickshire 389 was the only 1792 dated token the Boulton made for John Wilkinson, the iron manufacturer from Shropshire (the tokens were long ago erroneously attributed to Warwickshire instead of Shropshire and that has never been corrected.  Probably because there has not been a new book on the series since 1910.)  From the Watt collection I have a MS-62 1791 Lanarkshire 2 from Glasgow.  Why Watt had this token I don't know other than the fact that he was born in Scotland and this is one of the few tokens the firm made for a concern in Scotland.  And of course it is a very fandsome design.

[coinsandmedals]

1 hour ago, Conder101 said:

Nothing too special, from Boulton I have a PF-62 (grades are my own opinion, the coins are raw) 1795 Hertfordshire 4, and a PF-61 1792 Warwickshire 389.  The Hertfordshire 4 was Boultons favorite token design and he had several that he used to show prospective clients the kind of quality work Soho could do.  The Warwickshire 389 was the only 1792 dated token the Boulton made for John Wilkinson, the iron manufacturer from Shropshire (the tokens were long ago erroneously attributed to Warwickshire instead of Shropshire and that has never been corrected.  Probably because there has not been a new book on the series since 1910.)  From the Watt collection I have a MS-62 1791 Lanarkshire 2 from Glasgow.  Why Watt had this token I don't know other than the fact that he was born in Scotland and this is one of the few tokens the firm made for a concern in Scotland.  And of course it is a very fandsome design.

Very cool! Thank you for sharing. I am not nearly as well versed in his tokens as I am his regal issues. I see myself eventually going in that direction but for now, there is more than enough for me to focus on. I find that period of history to fascinating and the token trade was an integral part of it. I see the two as historically inseparable. I also find it very interesting how these tokens were viewed by some as collectible items form the start. That seems to be a somewhat unique aspect of these token for the period. 

[coinsandmedals]

Wow, I am impressed. These coins just came back from NGC, and Mr. Heller did a fantastic job making my wishful idea a reality. The quality of service provided by NGC never ceases to amaze me. To catch everyone up to speed, I had requested the silver-lined Soho Mint shells to be encapsulated alongside the coins. This task would require the use of a multi-coin holder. Part of the issue is that the multi-coin holders are only open for bulk submissions for specific members. I am not one of those members, and this was far from a bulk submission.
Furthermore, the multi-coin holders are designed to house coins with a set of particular diameters, none of which matched the items that I submitted. Despite all of this, NGC was able to able to fulfill my request and encapsulate the shells alongside their respective coins. I am incredibly impressed with how these turned out, and I can not thank enough Mr. Heller and all those who helped make this possible. I apologize for the somewhat horrible iPhone pictures. I probably should have waited until tonight to take better pictures, but I was just too excited not to share it with you all now. Certification numbers and bar codes have been removed from the pictures intentionally. 

1806 G. Britain Proof Farthing P-1391 Skinner Collection with Original Soho Shells

1806 G. Britain Proof ½ Penny P-1371 Skinner Collection with Original Soho Shells

[RWB]

Very, very nice!

[Star City Homer]

Can I ask how you contacted a specific person about a special slab?  I have something I'd like slabbed in an oversize holder.  It's a rectangle, and smaller than medals that are housed in the larger holders.  And, yes, there is a coin involved :D. It's just I'd like it preserved as is...and the one time I talked to someone they didn't quite understand (I don't think) and/or might not have been the right person.  I hesitate to send it in because if it's removed from the current holder then the uniqueness is completely lost.

To make this a little more clear, the label on this Ministry of Finance holder is getting smudged and I'd like to protect it.  Basically I want to slab the slab.  Side by side with another NGC slab for size.  I do NOT want the coin removed from the MoF holder under any circumstances.

 

[Jade Collection]

@coinsandmedals I could feel your excitement in your post, congrats on your coins and what they did for you on the coin shells!

@Star City Homer I hope you find your answer and get that slab encased and protected. I too would not want it cracked out.

[coinsandmedals]

Thanks everyone for the positive comments! I just could not wait to share this with everyone. It feels so amazing to have the shells preserved with the coins. I feel as though a good deal would have been lost had they ever been separated. 

@Star City Homer I am not sure how much help it will be, but I am going to send you a PM. 

[kbbpll]

Wow/ That's makes for an amazing presentation. Good job NGC.

[Conder101]

I'm green with envy.

And a BIG thank you to NGC for preserving these coins along with their important historical "original packaging".  I tend to criticize the TPG's a lot, but in this case nothing but praise.