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Question on a 69 S
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Started by NativeNat-ly,

19 posts in this topic

NativeNat-ly

NativeNat-ly

Posted
Posted

My question is- is this a double die. Sorry my pictures are horrible. I've been having hard time with my microscope camera and uploading. Thanks for your help! Also is this 69 s a floating roof?

 

IMG_20190522_230712.jpg

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Greenstang

Greenstang

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Posted

Can you show a picture of the complete coin both sides.

What I see there is Machine Doubling, you may have a floating roof but have to see complete coin to tell.

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Mohawk

Mohawk

Posted
Posted
10 hours ago, NativeNat-ly said:

My question is- is this a double die. Sorry my pictures are horrible. I've been having hard time with my microscope camera and uploading. Thanks for your help! Also is this 69 s a floating roof?

 

IMG_20190522_230712.jpg

Hi Nat-ly.  First off with the doubled die.....I don't know a polite way to say this but do not listen to Collector3745....he really doesn't know what he's talking about.  Now that we have that out of the way, I'm with Greenstang regarding the machine doubling.  I think that's what you have as well with your coin.  Machine doubling is extremely common on US coins of this era.  A picture of the whole coin would be very helpful.  As far as the floating roof, I found this post on another site which explains that

Quote

The "floating roof" is indeed a product of an over polished die, and that alone. It is NOT a mint error or a variety coin. It is a novelty type coin searched for by CRHers, and to them, has meaning but unless you con, er convince them to pay for one, it really is only worth a grand total of...1 cent.

So the floating roof isn't really worth looking for as it's just from an over polished die. 

I hope that this is helpful!
Keep Hunting!

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Crawtomatic

Crawtomatic

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Posted
41 minutes ago, Mohawk said:

Hi Nat-ly.  First off with the doubled die.....I don't know a polite way to say this but do not listen to Collector3745....he really doesn't know what he's talking about.  Now that we have that out of the way, I'm with Greenstang regarding the machine doubling.  I think that's what you have as well with your coin.  Machine doubling is extremely common on US coins of this era.  A picture of the whole coin would be very helpful.  As far as the floating roof, I found this post on another site which explains that

So the floating roof isn't really worth looking for as it's just from an over polished die. 

I hope that this is helpful!
Keep Hunting!

Agreed on all technical points, however, there's a history of collectability with overpolished dies and such.  I wouldn't necessarily say they're not worth looking for but more like, only look for the ones that have a niche market.  The "2 Feathers", "3-Legged", & "3 1/2 Legged" versions of Buffalo Nickels are popular segments of overpolished dies and draw quite the premium compared to the intended version. 

In the LMC series NGC provides attribution for the 1969-D "No FG" version (only 1 listed in Census Report) but I see nothing listed for a 69-S attribution under VarietyPlus.  I've seen these sell raw for $15-$20 and while I have no personal interest in them I set them aside if I notice them (half a tube of uncirculated on stock currently with no motivation to list them).  Since I'm discussing the 69-D version it's worth noting that it's possible to have the "floating roof" effect from overpolishing without the "FG" initials being completely polished away.  If there's any hint of initials then it's not considered - sorta like the half feather effect on "2 Feathers" that some sellers would try to pass off as a "2 1/2 Feathers" unethically.

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Mohawk

Mohawk

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, CRAWTOMATIC said:

Agreed on all technical points, however, there's a history of collectability with overpolished dies and such.  I wouldn't necessarily say they're not worth looking for but more like, only look for the ones that have a niche market.  The "2 Feathers", "3-Legged", & "3 1/2 Legged" versions of Buffalo Nickels are popular segments of overpolished dies and draw quite the premium compared to the intended version. 

In the LMC series NGC provides attribution for the 1969-D "No FG" version (only 1 listed in Census Report) but I see nothing listed for a 69-S attribution under VarietyPlus.  I've seen these sell raw for $15-$20 and while I have no personal interest in them I set them aside if I notice them (half a tube of uncirculated on stock currently with no motivation to list them).  Since I'm discussing the 69-D version it's worth noting that it's possible to have the "floating roof" effect from overpolishing without the "FG" initials being completely polished away.  If there's any hint of initials then it's not considered - sorta like the half feather effect on "2 Feathers" that some sellers would try to pass off as a "2 1/2 Feathers" unethically.

You make some very good points Crawtomatic.  However, from what I could find in my research, the "floating roof" cents are actually very common on many dates of this era and they don't have the kind of following that the Buffalo Nickel overpolished die varieties have.  As I am anything but a classic US coin guy, I did fail to account for those in my statement, though.  But there really isn't any demand for the floating roof cents that I could find, hence my assessment in my reply.  The no FG's do seem to have some limited demand, however, at least in the case of the 1969-D Lincoln Cent.

Edited by Mohawk
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Crawtomatic

Crawtomatic

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Posted
13 minutes ago, Mohawk said:

You make some very good points Crawtomatic.  However, from what I could find in my research, the "floating roof" cents are actually very common on many dates of this era and they don't have the kind of following that the Buffalo Nickel overpolished die varieties have.  As I am anything but a classic US coin guy, I did fail to account for those in my statement, though.  But there really isn't any demand for the floating roof cents that I could find, hence my assessment in my reply.  The no FG's do seem to have some limited demand, however, at least in the case of the 1969-D Lincoln Cent.

From what I've seen firsthand with the "floating roof" pennies they are really common for some years.  I recall checking a few tubes of late 60's cents for high grade MS in one sitting and I feel like 25-33% exhibited some form of "floating roofedness".  I think any demand that exists is the product of disinformation and ad barking behavior to generate value where none should exist.  (Thanks YouTube.)

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Conder101

Conder101

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Posted
2 hours ago, CRAWTOMATIC said:

Since I'm discussing the 69-D version it's worth noting that it's possible to have the "floating roof" effect from overpolishing without the "FG" initials being completely polished away. 

It is also possible to have a floating roof on ANY year Memorial cent, but for some reason it only seems to attract interest on the 1969's.  It's like the "bugs Bunny" Franklin halves,  They are known on all years but only seem to draw any attention or premium on the 1955.

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Mohawk

Mohawk

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25 minutes ago, CRAWTOMATIC said:

From what I've seen firsthand with the "floating roof" pennies they are really common for some years.  I recall checking a few tubes of late 60's cents for high grade MS in one sitting and I feel like 25-33% exhibited some form of "floating roofedness".  I think any demand that exists is the product of disinformation and ad barking behavior to generate value where none should exist.  (Thanks YouTube.)

Yeah......YouTube is terrible!! If I had a dime for every YouTube video that I know about who sensationalizes ridiculous things and spreads horrendous misinformation about out hobby, I could collect Faustina the Younger aureii along with my silver denarii.  I've seen people post links to these people here, mostly newbies, and that makes the situation even worse.  I wish YouTube would do something about them.....it's pretty bad. 

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Mohawk

Mohawk

Posted
Posted (edited)
55 minutes ago, Conder101 said:

It is also possible to have a floating roof on ANY year Memorial cent, but for some reason it only seems to attract interest on the 1969's.  It's like the "bugs Bunny" Franklin halves,  They are known on all years but only seem to draw any attention or premium on the 1955.

It's funny how that happens, isn't it?  I wonder what it is about the 1969 Lincolns that get people.  With the 1955 Franklin, I think part of it is the fact that particular coin has been hailed as a key date in the Franklin series for a long time (though there are scarcer coins in that series).  As for the 1969 cents, I can't even formulate a hypothesis.

Edited by Mohawk
Typo
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Mohawk

Mohawk

Posted
Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, NativeNat-ly said:

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Nat-ly,

Thanks for the additional photos.  I'm still going to say machine doubling on your coin.  As for the die polishing stuff, you do have a trace of the FG, it's faint but it's there.  So, the coin isn't the no FG variety.  However, I do think it is a "floating roof", but I also still think that it adds no value to the coin.  It's good to look at your change, though.  You never know what you may find.  I myself have found two 1984 DDO (the Doubled Ear, the good one) Lincoln Cents in change from the same grocery store about 6 months apart.  I sold them for about $80 each, so there's still good stuff to be found for someone who's determined. 

Best of Luck!
~Tom

Edited by Mohawk
Forgot to add Lincoln Cents in an important place.
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Mohawk

Mohawk

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35 minutes ago, Just Bob said:

Wow! the new close-ups are really clear and sharp. Well done!

Agreed with Bob.  You're doing great with the new photos!

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