AU Certified Early Commemoratives

[leeg]

Most folks collect these around the 64 to 68 grade.  I don't limit my search to a particular grade. My focus is on the coin.

 

As an example:

 

Let's see some AU and lower early commems.

[Just Bob]

Now, that is a good looking Alabama! 

[coinman1794]

A beautiful coin!

 

Some collectors like to put together a an AU55-58 set, sometimes in addition to a high-grade MS set. Still others are looking for richly toned, VF/XF Classic Commems with circulated cameo effect. There are many ways of collecting these interesting and under-appreciated coins.

[World Colonial]

7 hours ago, coinman1794 said:

 There are many ways of collecting these interesting and under-appreciated coins.

Classic commemoratives aren't under appreciated, just a lot cheaper than in the past and deservedly so.

The entire series is common (each and every issue) and subsequent to 1989 (or so) when prices peaked, the internet has forced it to compete with literally almost every other coin on the planet starting around 1999.  It should be apparent that even without the price bubble and subsequent crash, it isn't as competitive for either the financial buyer's or the collector's money as it was in the past given the much broader range of options. 

This is equally true to one extent or another for all of the most widely collected US series.  NCLT and to a lesser extent world coinage have displaced demand for most of the coins in the most common US series.  The collector base is presumably noticeably larger than in 1989 when this series peaked, but it doesn't seem to be enough to offset the decline in marginal demand.

[coinman1794]

Finding a choice original XF with Circulated Cameo appearance, or a beautifully toned choice AU, is quite difficult; and because one often does not have to pay much for one, they seem underappreciated. Also, in terms of MS coins, when compared to other half dollars of the period, in similar grades, which had mintage figures of many millions, these coins are definitely not selling at levels commensurate with their actual scarcity. Thus, they are underappreciated.

[World Colonial]

57 minutes ago, coinman1794 said:

Finding a choice original XF with Circulated Cameo appearance, or a beautifully toned choice AU, is quite difficult; and because one often does not have to pay much for one, they seem underappreciated. Also, in terms of MS coins, when compared to other half dollars of the period, in similar grades, which had mintage figures of many millions, these coins are definitely not selling at levels commensurate with their actual scarcity. Thus, they are underappreciated.

I am aware of what you describe.  The coins you are comparing it to which I presume are Franklin halves and common date WLH, those aren't competitive at similar prices either.  If relative desirability is the criteria,  I am telling you there are many other coins with far better numismatic credentials which collectors did not have access to until the internet age selling for similar prices. 

Any coin can be defined as "scarce" if the criteria is defined narrowly or arbitrarily enough.  Additionally, comparing mintages isn't valid between two series which were intended for circulation and classic commemoratives which did circulate somewhat but weren't intended to do so.  Common WLH and Franklin halves are more common in equivalent grade or quality (due to hoarding) but all are very common except under the most liberal criteria. 

It's also evident that the preference for classic commemoratives is very coin specific unlike the generic one for these two series.  For example, the Hawaii is apparently very "popular" (with a strong collector preference) but solely based upon it's availability, I'd rate it one of the most overpriced coins in the entire US series.  It isn't anything other than very common and the low mintage doesn't change this statement.  Collectors just like it, a lot - as they do with WLH.

These coins have the benefit of an outsized US collector base with a predisposition to collect US coins but nothing else.  Classic commemoratives have fallen relentlessly since the bubble peak in 1989 but I can't even remember how many times I have read forum comments (or articles in the numismatic press) inferring or claiming it was cheap and should sell for more. 

Absent a huge run up in the silver spot price or another speculative bubble from marketing, financially you can stick a fork in this series.  These two explanations are the most likely catalyst to noticeably increase financial buying which is the only reason I can see why demand will ever increase noticeably for it.  If there is another catalyst to drive the preference higher for this series generically, I'd really like to hear it. 

Individual coins may (and probably will) continue to maintain the current preference but the series as a whole will become even less competitive as new collecting options are available (think primarily new NCLT).

Anyway, I wasn't trying to pick on your post and yes, I do think the pictured coin from the OP is a nice one.

[Mr.Mcknowitall]

In general, I would concur with your comments for post 1954 Commemorative pieces.

My opinion is that pre-1955, there is a very special historical subject aspect (and except for a very few) presented in a manner of artistry and design that support the historical significance and is what makes these pieces and series special and desirable to collectors. When consideration is given to the many years that did not have a commemorative piece issued, the "short set"...pre-1955...takes on a second level of significance. Sure, over the years and on many occasions, pricing manipulation in the market caused these pieces to increase and decrease to the point of exasperation. But, the down cycles always end,  and the price recovers, and collectors have cherished this series as long as I can remember.

As to condition, it is of interest to note that a very low percentage of these pieces were kept in pristine condition, and were cleaned/dusted/dunked/made pretty for display on the mantel and/or the family album/gatherings, where they were passed around and ooed and ahhhed and in the process dinged/banged/wiped/dropped, etc. There were very few die hard collectors that were knowledgeable in storage and preservation, and even fewer that could even afford such pieces, except maybe post Korean war, when the economy started to truly produce disposable income that a collector did not feel guilty about spending for a coin. Also, we have to remember that the pieces that didn't sell were for the most part returned to the Mint and melted. This happened a lot more often than mint totals would suggest. On many occasions, pieces were released for circulation. These factors made already low mintage numbers even lower, and to the point that today we really don't know the true final availability on many pieces. Thus, outstanding circulated pieces equaling the piece above are rare, and I would suggest very rare. In 65 and above (and please understand I am not referring to market grading) it is even more difficult to obtain. We also have to realize what we are buying with a $ today, vs. say 1980 and 88, 2 big downturns I cringed at on behalf of collectors. The series is a bargain accordingly and pieces that are of the quality I described are actually rising and when appear are quickly bought. Yes, there are a few high mintage pieces (high for the series), such as the Columbian Exposition, the 52 BTW (some would say the same for the 46 BTW but we just don't know how many saw the fire). Even then, exceptional pieces are not frequently encountered.

I consider the pieces I am describing scarce and certainly desirable under any criteria. I freely admit that my nature and interest is and always has been a love of history of all things and no less so for numismatics, and this personality fault of course infects my opinions. I do not view the subject from an investment point of view, except as an investment for preserving history for the future.

[leeg]

Thanks all for comments.

[leeg]

My next AU example:

 

[numisport]

I like early commemorative coins 1892 to lets say late thirties. Like AU commems for you I choose AU Peace Dollar set. Common date AU Peace Dollars are tough to find nice with that original look.

[leeg]

7 hours ago, numisport said:

I like early commemorative coins 1892 to lets say late thirties. Like AU commems for you I choose AU Peace Dollar set. Common date AU Peace Dollars are tough to find nice with that original look.

Right you are.

[leeg]

My newest AU-53 early commemorative:

[robec1347]

Very nice examples Lee

My one AU Classic Commemorative 

 

[leeg]

5 hours ago, robec1347 said:

Very nice examples Lee

My one AU Classic Commemorative 

 

Very ncie!!

[leeg]

On ‎8‎/‎9‎/‎2018 at 11:06 PM, Just Bob said:

Now, that is a good looking Alabama! 

Thank you Sir. 

[leeg]

On ‎8‎/‎14‎/‎2018 at 1:44 PM, robec1347 said:

Very nice examples Lee

My one AU Classic Commemorative 

 

Thanks Bob!

[physics-fan3.14]

Do you suspect these AU commems actually served time in commerce and acquired their wear in the usual way? Or do you suppose these have cabinet friction, from being handled in a collection for a hundred years? I suspect this is cabinet, or maybe album, friction - which is also where they developed this exquisite toning. 

[leeg]

On ‎8‎/‎18‎/‎2018 at 9:32 AM, physics-fan3.14 said:

Do you suspect these AU commems actually served time in commerce and acquired their wear in the usual way? Or do you suppose these have cabinet friction, from being handled in a collection for a hundred years? I suspect this is cabinet, or maybe album, friction - which is also where they developed this exquisite toning. 

A massive amount were put back into circulation. I agree with you in all your evaluations.

[coinman1794]

On 8/18/2018 at 9:32 AM, physics-fan3.14 said:

Do you suspect these AU commems actually served time in commerce and acquired their wear in the usual way? Or do you suppose these have cabinet friction, from being handled in a collection for a hundred years? I suspect this is cabinet, or maybe album, friction - which is also where they developed this exquisite toning. 

A lot of the ones I've seen had circulation wear. The services are giving MS62s and Ms63s to cabinet friction piece these days

[Just Bob]

1 hour ago, coinman1794 said:

A lot of the ones I've seen had circulation wear. The services are giving MS62s and Ms63s to cabinet friction piece these days

I disagree with this practice. Wear is wear, whether from sliding in a cabinet or being carried in my pocket. A coin with wear should not grade MS anything. I think the numismatic community as a whole is smart enough to know that a gem coin with cabinet friction is worth as much, in most cases, as a lower mint state coin without the grading services having to tell us it is so by giving it a grade bump.

[leeg]

I also am working a 7070. When I first started working the 7070 I could see the slide marks. I was much more careful after that.

As one gains experience in the hobby you can recognize the type of damage that occurred with a coin.