Bought a mint set

[toyonakataro]

Sorry, not a US mint set, but I bought a Japanese mint set from 1981 whitch is notorious for containing PVC

I bought the set because I liked the color on copper whitch is toning pink.

I think I want to have the copper coin graded by NGC, but the mint holder is already sticky somehow.

Whitch do you think is the better way for me to do?

① Take the coin out of the mint set and acetone dip the coin by myself , then send it to NGC.

②Leave the copper coin in original holder(in that case, I'll take other coins out from the set) and send the holder to NCS and ask them to take care of it.

I personally would like to dip the copper by myself and send it to NGC, but I'm afraid they might question the color on it.

What would you do?

[Conder101]

If you are afraid they would question the color, I would send it still in the government packaging.  You will have to send it for conservation and slabbing.

[toyonakataro]

Yes, I'm concerened about what NGC would think of the toning on the coin.

Sorry for not so great picture, but what do you think of the color on the coin?

[e1cnr]

some of that color may be due to a light PVC film on coin, which could change with acetone treatment

[erwindoc]

I have had "original mint packaging" coins BB'd by NGC.  

[numisport]

I doubt that PVC damage is reversible and will be recognized by NGC.

[toyonakataro]

10 hours ago, e1cnr said:

some of that color may be due to a light PVC film on coin, which could change with acetone treatment

I bought the coin because of the pretty color on the copper. If the "pretty color" is caused by PVC and color would change after applying acetone on it, then it's not worth sending it to NGC/NCS

[toyonakataro]

10 hours ago, erwindoc said:

I have had "original mint packaging" coins BB'd by NGC.  

Do you mean you sent coins sealed in original mint package and bodybagged?  In that case, what was the reason for the BB?

Questionable color or any other reason?

[toyonakataro]

8 hours ago, numisport said:

I doubt that PVC damage is reversible and will be recognized by NGC.

I've heared that PVC damage is rescurable unless the damages are severe enough to eat the surface of the coin, but I may be wrong.

[Six Mile Rick]

Try some MS70 on it. Keep the color and reduce the PVC.

[toyonakataro]

11 hours ago, Rick's Keepers said:

Try some MS70 on it. Keep the color and reduce the PVC.

I've heared that MS70 would change the color of copper, but is that the only case with proof indian cents?

Anyway, I'm reluctant to use chemical on the coin by myself except for using acetone.

[physics-fan3.14]

22 hours ago, toyonakataro said:

I've heared that MS70 would change the color of copper, but is that the only case with proof indian cents?

Anyway, I'm reluctant to use chemical on the coin by myself except for using acetone.

Absolutely, 100% do not use MS70 on copper. 

PVC is best removed by acetone. 

It's a little tricky to get a clear idea of the color with the glare on the plastic, but I've seen that shade of pink toning on copper before. Here is one of my Lincoln cents certified problem free by PCGS to compare: 

 

[cladking]

I've never had much luck reversing color changes on Japanese mint sets but I use mostly 91% isopropyl with a little acetone.  On earlier dates most could be saved 10 years ago but I wouldn't bet that they still can.  '81 sets often aren't too bad yet. 

[toyonakataro]

5 hours ago, physics-fan3.14 said:

It's a little tricky to get a clear idea of the color with the glare on the plastic, but I've seen that shade of pink toning on copper before. Here is one of my Lincoln cents certified problem free by PCGS to compare: 

If you think the color on my copper is MA, then I will open the mintset and dip in acetone and see what happenes.

[toyonakataro]

2 hours ago, cladking said:

I've never had much luck reversing color changes on Japanese mint sets but I use mostly 91% isopropyl with a little acetone.  On earlier dates most could be saved 10 years ago but I wouldn't bet that they still can.  '81 sets often aren't too bad yet. 

I bought the set because I liked the color change on the copper coin. I don't know how to acquire isopropyl and I already have a bollte of acetone, so I'll try acetone first.  By the way, I'm impressed/surprised to see a person knowledgeable about Japanese mint set on this forum.

[cladking]

These are fairly high mintage sets and I collect moderns from all over the world.  It's not unusual for mint set coins to be the sole source for moderns.  Some of the packaging is just horrible

[Conder101]

On 5/13/2017 at 8:15 PM, toyonakataro said:

If the "pretty color" is caused by PVC and color would change after applying acetone on it, then it's not worth sending it to NGC/NCS

The problem is you can't know for sure if the color will change until you apply the acetone, and if it does then it is too late.

 

On 5/13/2017 at 8:22 PM, toyonakataro said:

I've heared that PVC damage is rescurable unless the damages are severe enough to eat the surface of the coin,

PVC RESIDUE is recoverable, PVC DAMAGE is forever.

 

23 hours ago, toyonakataro said:

If you think the color on my copper is MA, then I will open the mintset and dip in acetone and see what happenes.

It doesn't matter if he thinks it is MA, it depends on what the TPG thinks, and having out of the OGP increases the odds that they may think it has been altered.

 

23 hours ago, toyonakataro said:

I don't know how to acquire isopropyl

Common name for Isopropynol is rubbing alcohol.  Available at all drug stores. pharmacies, and other places in thier phamacy/health depatments.  Tends to come in 50%, 70% and 91% alcohol concentrations  Typically the higher the concentration the better.

[toyonakataro]

4 hours ago, Conder101 said:

The problem is you can't know for sure if the color will change until you apply the acetone, and if it does then it is too late.

If the color change and return to original color after applying to acetone, then I'll give up sending the coin to NGC and just spend it.

 

4 hours ago, Conder101 said:

PVC RESIDUE is recoverable, PVC DAMAGE is forever.

Seems like I had mixed up the term "residue" and "damage"

 

4 hours ago, Conder101 said:

It doesn't matter if he thinks it is MA, it depends on what the TPG thinks, and having out of the OGP increases the odds that they may think it has been altered.

I know physics-fan314 is not a grader at NGC, but taking a knowledgeable member's opinions into account isn't a bad idea. 

If there's a chance that I send the coin in original holder to NCS and the collor on the coin changes soon after they used acetone, It'll really be a waste of money. I would rather use acetone myself and see what happenes and decide what to do next.  But before taking the coin out of the holder, I might post on "ask NCS" about this coin.

5 hours ago, Conder101 said:

Common name for Isopropynol is rubbing alcohol.  Available at all drug stores. pharmacies, and other places in thier phamacy/health depatments.  Tends to come in 50%, 70% and 91% alcohol concentrations  Typically the higher the concentration the better.

Is rubbing alcohol safer to use on copper coins than acetone?

[Conder101]

Not really safer, it's just that Acetone, Isopropanol, and Xylene are each better at removing certain things than the other two.   Something that won't come off with one may come off with one of the other two.  (and some things won't come off with any of them).  None of them will affect the metal of the coin.  Personally I prefer the Acetone, I've had more luck with it removing things than xylene.  Isopropanol contains a fair amount of water which helps on water solvable substances, but is slower drying.  I tend to dry with a final flowing acetone rinse, and if I'm going to do that why not just start with acetone as well? 

[toyonakataro]

Thank you for the clarification. As I mentioned before, I already have a bottle of acetone. So if I'm going to apply something on the coin by myself, I'll go with acetone first.

[Six Mile Rick]

On 5/14/2017 at 6:52 PM, toyonakataro said:

I've heared that MS70 would change the color of copper, but is that the only case with proof indian cents?

Anyway, I'm reluctant to use chemical on the coin by myself except for using acetone.

I'm not a collector of coppers but it has worked well on Silver and Clad  coins. (to retain the toning)

On 5/15/2017 at 5:33 PM, physics-fan3.14 said:

Absolutely, 100% do not use MS70 on copper. 

PVC is best removed by acetone. 

It's a little tricky to get a clear idea of the color with the glare on the plastic, but I've seen that shade of pink toning on copper before. Here is one of my Lincoln cents certified problem free by PCGS to compare: 

 

Well --- there is your answer on the MS70 for copper !!  Jason must have tried it in the past.

[Six Mile Rick]

Keep us posted on your decision!! ---- pics!!