Why is this forum so poorly followed?

[Mozin]

I have been an active member on the PCGS US forum and I enjoy it immensely. Why is this NGC forum so poorly followed? There is hardly any activity on it.

[Leothelion]

I have been an active member on the PCGS US forum and I enjoy it immensely. Why is this NGC forum so poorly followed? There is hardly any activity on it.

 

That odd! Two weeks ago you said this was a great site!

 

Leo

[Oldtrader3]

This forum is a lot more low key than the other forum. I hardly ever go over there and prefer it here

 

I think that the mellow tone here happens to suit many of us. To each their own I guess. Besides, there are over 4000 members on this forum. That does not connotate a small following to me.

[Mozin]

I have been an active member on the PCGS US forum and I enjoy it immensely. Why is this NGC forum so poorly followed? There is hardly any activity on it.

 

That odd! Two weeks ago you said this was a great site!

 

Leo

 

You are mistaken. I was referring to the site mentioned in the thread, not the NGC forum.

 

Here is the site that I was suggesting as a great site http://www.busthalfprices.com/index.php

[gmarguli]

I have been an active member on the PCGS US forum and I enjoy it immensely. Why is this NGC forum so poorly followed? There is hardly any activity on it.

 

That's because we don't have a thousand posts about:

 

* How many months submissions are taking.

* Submission results.

* Look at my Kennedy half.

* Am I'm being screwed out of my free submissions because PCGS took 4 months to grade my 15-day submission, but now they're saying a PCGS work day is only considered every second Tuesday of every third month.

* Look at my new 1996 mint registry set. It scores 68.76 out of 68.78 possible.

* Look at this auction.

[Leothelion]

I have been an active member on the PCGS US forum and I enjoy it immensely. Why is this NGC forum so poorly followed? There is hardly any activity on it.

 

That odd! Two weeks ago you said this was a great site!

 

Leo

 

You are mistaken. I was referring to the site mentioned in the thread, not the NGC forum.

 

Here is the site that I was suggesting as a great site http://www.busthalfprices.com/index.php

 

I wasn't mistaken! You made no mention about another website! Did you actually think I'm to reread the entire thread I could care less about! I could've cared but it's just not my bag!

 

Leo

[Mozin]

I have been an active member on the PCGS US forum and I enjoy it immensely. Why is this NGC forum so poorly followed? There is hardly any activity on it.

 

That's because we don't have a thousand posts about:

 

* How many months submissions are taking.

* Submission results.

* Look at my Kennedy half.

* Am I'm being screwed out of my free submissions because PCGS took 4 months to grade my 15-day submission, but now they're saying a PCGS work day is only considered every second Tuesday of every third month.

* Look at my new 1996 mint registry set. It scores 68.76 out of 68.78 possible.

* Look at this auction.

 

I agree with every single item you listed above as being of no interest to me whatsoever but it still does not say why this forum is so utterly inactive. Just what is it that interests you folks? If it is modern stuff I won't waste my time here. Talk about Early Commems, Bust series, Early US gold, or Early type and I am all ears.

[Hoot]

I agree with every single item you listed above as being of no interest to me whatsoever but it still does not say why this forum is so utterly inactive. Just what is it that interests you folks? If it is modern stuff I won't waste my time here. Talk about Early Commems, Bust series, Early US gold, or Early type and I am all ears.

 

Please post some of your own threads on these topics - then we'll be glad to jump in and also be all ears.

 

Hoot

[Leothelion]

I agree with every single item you listed above as being of no interest to me whatsoever but it still does not say why this forum is so utterly inactive. Just what is it that interests you folks? If it is modern stuff I won't waste my time here. Talk about Early Commems, Bust series, Early US gold, or Early type and I am all ears.

 

Please post some of your own threads on these topics - then we'll be glad to jump in and also be all ears.

 

Hoot

 

Or try the "Search" button on words like "busts", "early halves", "commemoratives", etc! You can chime in on any of those topics!

 

Leo

[Mozin]

I have been an active member on the PCGS US forum and I enjoy it immensely. Why is this NGC forum so poorly followed? There is hardly any activity on it.

 

That odd! Two weeks ago you said this was a great site!

 

Leo

 

You are mistaken. I was referring to the site mentioned in the thread, not the NGC forum.

 

Here is the site that I was suggesting as a great site http://www.busthalfprices.com/index.php

 

I wasn't mistaken! You made no mention about another website! Did you actually think I'm to reread the entire thread I could care less about! I could've cared but it's just not my bag!

 

Leo

 

Leo,

 

I wrote and specifically directed my comment to Bill, who was the person commenting immediately above me in the earlier thread, to say his link was great. You should have been able to at least read what was immediately above my comment without having as you said "to reread the entire thread I could care less about!". That is not a very considerate statement to make towards the people that commented in the thread or to the person starting the thread.

[cpm9ball]

I agree with every single item you listed above as being of no interest to me whatsoever but it still does not say why this forum is so utterly inactive. Just what is it that interests you folks? If it is modern stuff I won't waste my time here. Talk about Early Commems, Bust series, Early US gold, or Early type and I am all ears.

 

Mozin , I think you are being too quick to judge. But, if you are looking for a forum that covers only your interests , then maybe you should look elsewhere, or, for that matter, start your own and keep anyone out who doesn't have your same interests.

 

My interests in collecting were rekindled in the 90's after a 30 year hiatus. Unfortunately, some of the series that I would prefer to collect are now out of my price range. That doesn't mean that I can't enjoy them through interaction with other members of these boards. There is a wide, wide range of interests, here, and tons of knowledge for anyone who wishes to expand their educational horizons.

 

So what, if I collect moderns! So what if Greg doesn't like my Kennedys! Does it mean that I should be exiled to the Sunday Comics? Isn't that being a little narrow-minded? I consider myself extremely fortunate that the other members put up with me and give me the opportunity to "pick their cumulative minds" for thousands of years of stored data. And, maybe, just maybe, there will be one occasion where I can offer a bit of information that will help someone else. I think I said it in another thread, somewhere, "Where can you pay only $99 a year for "tuition" and get a million dollar education?"

 

Inactive? Excuse me while I go take my Geritol. Be back in an hour.

 

Chris

[kryptonitecomics]

I actually have to agree with Mozin...it's a fair question. I don't mind....I get what I need and want out of these boards and I certainly don't see the flame wars that go on over on PCGS, but the activity level is non existant over here compared to PCGS so....why are folks jumping up to defend NGC......it didn't sound like an attack, but rather a very accurate observation that others have noted numerous times in the past

[James_OldeTowne]

((( I have been an active member on the PCGS US forum and I enjoy it immensely. Why is this NGC forum so poorly followed? There is hardly any activity on it. )))

 

Mozin, your question implies that "plenty of activity" somehow means a forum is well followed. But "much activity" could also mean there's a lot more "noise" to drown out the useful information. And personally, I prefer a forum where the percent of garbage is not so large, so there's less noise I have to tune out.

 

I did happen to jump over to the PCGS forum last week, and couldn't stomach the nonsense going on there. It took me probably fifteen minutes just to fumble through the first ten threads, and I brought away little more than something about a major dealer complaining about minor dealers.

 

The real coin hobby isn't 90% about noise like that, at least not to me. I appreciate the low key, but genuine enthusiasm that appears on the NGC forum. But that's just me. There are many folks who love loud, noisy places, and I respect that as well. Some folks like dancing, and some like to go to the movies.

 

James

[SilverDollarMan]

I actually have to agree with Mozin...it's a fair question. I don't mind....I get what I need and want out of these boards and I certainly don't see the flame wars that go on over on PCGS, but the activity level is non existant over here compared to PCGS so....why are folks jumping up to defend NGC......it didn't sound like an attack, but rather a very accurate observation that others have noted numerous times in the past

 

I have to agree. I have often wondered the same thing. NOW....hold on, this is my FAVORITE forum. But can we answer his question? TIA

 

This place is 10X more freindly too...and willing to help w/o being a bunch of Snobs. Thx to EVERYONE!

[kryptonitecomics]

Yes....I think we all just aoppreciate sleepy hollow for what it is whithout worring about why your post will stay on the front page for several days

[prooflike]

I don't like the software/layout NGC uses for their forums and their site is slow at times.

[James_OldeTowne]

"prooflike" brings up a valid point. Whatever software PCGS uses (and I'm no software or website expert by any means), their forum is quite a bit more responsive than what NGC uses.

 

James

[TomB]

I have been an active member on the PCGS US forum and I enjoy it immensely. Why is this NGC forum so poorly followed? There is hardly any activity on it.

 

I believe that there is nothing wrong with this observation, per se, other than the inference that the NGC boards are poorly followed, rather than sparsely active. I also believe that there is nothing wrong with this discussion, and will try to give you my opinions, observations and personal experience.

 

In other words, this may be a long post, so those of you famimliar with me might want to catch up on some sleep.

 

I had been one of the long time supporters of the PCGS boards, going back to before the current boards were started and at a time where the activity level of the NGC boards seemed busy to what was then the level at PCGS. Upon the activation of the NGC site I thought it was terrific because a healthy and vibrant numismatic hobby/industry needs more than one healthy and vibrant meeting place to share knowledge and experience. This is much more critical than most people realize, and so I will highlight it:

 

A healthy and vibrant numismatic hobby/industry needs more than one healthy and vibrant meeting place to share knowledge and experience.

 

Think about it.

 

Anyway, I contributed at both PCGS and NGC for perhaps a month after the NGC site started until two of my posts were edited without my permission! I was annoyed, these were not nasty or aggressive posts, but they were edited by someone then in the employ of NGC. I stated my dissatisfaction with this on both the NGC and PCGS boards and, in fact, probably helped to muzzle the growth of these boards.

 

My posts at NGC continued sporadically, and at PCGS heavily, until March 2003 when a decision was made at PCGS that I can only describe as short-sighte, arrogant and wrong, although one that was also clearly within the rights of PCGS management as the owners of the PCGS board. My personal decision was that my knowledge, expertise and help improve the quality of the PCGS board and brand and that voluntarily reducing my participation at PCGS would reduce the value of the PCGS site. Perhaps this is extremely big-headed, but it is also accurate. I came back to NGC full-time, sent a PM to the system administrator to ask questions as to why my earlier posts had been edited and was told that the NGC administrator had no knowledge that this former employee of NGC had been manipulating posts as he was specifically not allowed to do so.

 

I was satisfied with the answer and devoted my posting to NGC until I felt that I would like to post at PCGS again.

 

It was not until seventeen months later that I again posted at PCGS, and this was spurred on by the personal tragedy of another member. Since then, I have posted on both boards, though I average less than one post a day at PCGS since my return.

 

My experience is different than most, so why do I think others don't post at NGC vs both NGC and PCGS? Here is a list of possible reasons that are certain to be incomplete-

 

1) Brand loyalty to PCGS. This is a very odd reason, in my mind, but it is something that I read on the PCGS boards with some regularity in posts by a number, but certainly not all contributors. I can only relate to this in that it seems that some folks feel they will be unfaithful if they do not support their fondness of PCGS with a reciprocal distance toward NGC. I don't quite understand the mentality but it reminds me of rooting for your favorite sport team while at the same time rooting for the demise of their arch rival.

 

2) A feeling of comfort at PCGS. Remember, the PCGS boards had been around for quite a bit of time when the NGC boards started, and there is a lot to say for having a certain comfort level in order to participate. When I started to post exclusively at NGC even I did not feel as comfortable as I had at PCGS, though I knew that the feeling would diminish.

 

3) The herd mentality. It may not be polite to think in these terms, but folks like a winner and like to jump on the bandwagon of a winner. Many people perceive PCGS as the winner in the "sport of boards" and they want to be affiliated with the winner. If most of the folks that you typically interact with do not post at NGC then there is little motivation for you to post at NGC. It takes a level of courage to leave the comfort zone and post alone.

 

4) The addictiveness of the internet. This might seem strange, but I would bet a substantial sum that most of us, as we use the internet more, require more from the internet in order to feel sated. This extends to the coin boards, where they seem enormous when we are newbies, but then appear lacking or hollow as we obtain experience.

 

5) The current ease of interaction at PCGS vs NGC in terms of having at least one person with the required expertise to answer a question in some niche of the hobby/industry. This is really just a function of mass action. There are more folks who occassionally participate at PCGS and so there is a greater probability that your question or desire can be fulfilled by someone at PCGS.

 

6) The software layout of the PCGS and NGC boards. Currently, I prefer more things about the NGC boards than I do about the PCGS boards. However, this was not always the case. I like the PM system and colors of the PCGS boards better, in contrast I prefer the file size attachment and collapsable mode of the NGC site.

 

7) Time and effort. Let's face it, if you are going to put the time into writing a detailed post (such as this one) and you want the most people to read it, then you are likely going to post at PCGS. The ability to cut-and-paste makes it trivial to start a thread on both sites, yet there are few who will make this effort.

 

8) The sometimes subtle and sporadic nature of the NGC bashing that occurs at PCGS. Please note that bashing can occur at both sites about many things. However, I read more posts at PCGS that are pejorative of NGC than I do the reverse. This view, when reinforced over time, can tend to keep people away from finding the positive aspects of both boards, and that results in a loss to those who do not make the effort to seek the truth.

 

9) The PCGS Registry. I have written for some time now that the person who came up with the idea for the Registry should be given an enormous bonus. Aside from inferred superiority of product and increased submissions of coins that might not have otherwise been slabbed, the PCGS Registry draws people of like-mind onto the boards. Since they are participating in the PCGS Registry, they tend to devote their activities to the PCGS boards. Oddly, NGC does not nearly promote their Registry to the extent that PCGS does, yet an objective view of the Registries may very well come to the conclusion that the NGC Registry is the better planned Registry.

 

10) Folks like you. Please, that is not a slam!!! I notice that you have been a registered member of NGC since mid-February yet have only posted about one dozen times. This is about once every three days, and many of those posts are in this thread. Certainly, over all this time there have had to be some interesting threads here at NGC for you to participate in, haven't there? I believe you wrote that you enjoy Bust coinage, well, I have started two threads in this time frame that specifically relate to Bust coinage and in each thread I ask for participation. If you are not familiar with me yet, my posts tend to be long and filled with information; this is an invitation to join the discussion and share. Your participation is not unique as there are many folks who choose not to contribute, even when the topic is directly in their interests.

 

You may recall that at the beginning of my post that I wrote that the NGC boards should not be described as being poorly followed and the reason for this is that we have an large number of folks who actively read the boards but do not participate. Thererfore, they seem to be followed well. I know this because I have received many emails following my posts from folks who read the NGC boards but who do not post. In these emails they share information with me, correct my errors, invite further discussion, set up meetings and generally write that they enjoy the NGC boards very much. Yet they are not visible members and that might make the NGC boards appear weaker than they truly are.

 

My opinion of the two boards is that they are both valuable, that the posting velocity at PCGS far exceeds that at NGC, that the signal-to-noise ratio at NGC is higher than that at PCGS and that I do not necessarily see these observations changing dramatically anytime soon.

 

I invite you to post more at NGC and to encourage others who enjoy our terrific hobby/industry to do the same.

[TomB]

By the way, I think this is an excellent thread topic!

[Hoot]

 

 

 

Great post Tom.

 

Hoot

[nwcs]

An interesting thread for me to make a post here on. I'll answer this from my own perspective relating only to me. I used to post both here and across the street often. But I just didn't have time to keep up with everything. I chose the other because more people were there and I really really really wanted to reach 10000 posts there. I've been there and done that and am starting to yearn for some more meat with my coins. So I've been considering a shift back.

[Mozin]

I have been an active member on the PCGS US forum and I enjoy it immensely. Why is this NGC forum so poorly followed? There is hardly any activity on it.

 

I believe that there is nothing wrong with this observation, per se, other than the inference that the NGC boards are poorly followed, rather than sparsely active. I also believe that there is nothing wrong with this discussion, and will try to give you my opinions, observations and personal experience.

 

In other words, this may be a long post, so those of you famimliar with me might want to catch up on some sleep.

 

I had been one of the long time supporters of the PCGS boards, going back to before the current boards were started and at a time where the activity level of the NGC boards seemed busy to what was then the level at PCGS. Upon the activation of the NGC site I thought it was terrific because a healthy and vibrant numismatic hobby/industry needs more than one healthy and vibrant meeting place to share knowledge and experience. This is much more critical than most people realize, and so I will highlight it:

 

A healthy and vibrant numismatic hobby/industry needs more than one healthy and vibrant meeting place to share knowledge and experience.

 

Think about it.

 

Anyway, I contributed at both PCGS and NGC for perhaps a month after the NGC site started until two of my posts were edited without my permission! I was annoyed, these were not nasty or aggressive posts, but they were edited by someone then in the employ of NGC. I stated my dissatisfaction with this on both the NGC and PCGS boards and, in fact, probably helped to muzzle the growth of these boards.

 

My posts at NGC continued sporadically, and at PCGS heavily, until March 2003 when a decision was made at PCGS that I can only describe as short-sighte, arrogant and wrong, although one that was also clearly within the rights of PCGS management as the owners of the PCGS board. My personal decision was that my knowledge, expertise and help improve the quality of the PCGS board and brand and that voluntarily reducing my participation at PCGS would reduce the value of the PCGS site. Perhaps this is extremely big-headed, but it is also accurate. I came back to NGC full-time, sent a PM to the system administrator to ask questions as to why my earlier posts had been edited and was told that the NGC administrator had no knowledge that this former employee of NGC had been manipulating posts as he was specifically not allowed to do so.

 

I was satisfied with the answer and devoted my posting to NGC until I felt that I would like to post at PCGS again.

 

It was not until seventeen months later that I again posted at PCGS, and this was spurred on by the personal tragedy of another member. Since then, I have posted on both boards, though I average less than one post a day at PCGS since my return.

 

My experience is different than most, so why do I think others don't post at NGC vs both NGC and PCGS? Here is a list of possible reasons that are certain to be incomplete-

 

1) Brand loyalty to PCGS. This is a very odd reason, in my mind, but it is something that I read on the PCGS boards with some regularity in posts by a number, but certainly not all contributors. I can only relate to this in that it seems that some folks feel they will be unfaithful if they do not support their fondness of PCGS with a reciprocal distance toward NGC. I don't quite understand the mentality but it reminds me of rooting for your favorite sport team while at the same time rooting for the demise of their arch rival.

 

2) A feeling of comfort at PCGS. Remember, the PCGS boards had been around for quite a bit of time when the NGC boards started, and there is a lot to say for having a certain comfort level in order to participate. When I started to post exclusively at NGC even I did not feel as comfortable as I had at PCGS, though I knew that the feeling would diminish.

 

3) The herd mentality. It may not be polite to think in these terms, but folks like a winner and like to jump on the bandwagon of a winner. Many people perceive PCGS as the winner in the "sport of boards" and they want to be affiliated with the winner. If most of the folks that you typically interact with do not post at NGC then there is little motivation for you to post at NGC. It takes a level of courage to leave the comfort zone and post alone.

 

4) The addictiveness of the internet. This might seem strange, but I would bet a substantial sum that most of us, as we use the internet more, require more from the internet in order to feel sated. This extends to the coin boards, where they seem enormous when we are newbies, but then appear lacking or hollow as we obtain experience.

 

5) The current ease of interaction at PCGS vs NGC in terms of having at least one person with the required expertise to answer a question in some niche of the hobby/industry. This is really just a function of mass action. There are more folks who occassionally participate at PCGS and so there is a greater probability that your question or desire can be fulfilled by someone at PCGS.

 

6) The software layout of the PCGS and NGC boards. Currently, I prefer more things about the NGC boards than I do about the PCGS boards. However, this was not always the case. I like the PM system and colors of the PCGS boards better, in contrast I prefer the file size attachment and collapsable mode of the NGC site.

 

7) Time and effort. Let's face it, if you are going to put the time into writing a detailed post (such as this one) and you want the most people to read it, then you are likely going to post at PCGS. The ability to cut-and-paste makes it trivial to start a thread on both sites, yet there are few who will make this effort.

 

8) The sometimes subtle and sporadic nature of the NGC bashing that occurs at PCGS. Please note that bashing can occur at both sites about many things. However, I read more posts at PCGS that are pejorative of NGC than I do the reverse. This view, when reinforced over time, can tend to keep people away from finding the positive aspects of both boards, and that results in a loss to those who do not make the effort to seek the truth.

 

9) The PCGS Registry. I have written for some time now that the person who came up with the idea for the Registry should be given an enormous bonus. Aside from inferred superiority of product and increased submissions of coins that might not have otherwise been slabbed, the PCGS Registry draws people of like-mind onto the boards. Since they are participating in the PCGS Registry, they tend to devote their activities to the PCGS boards. Oddly, NGC does not nearly promote their Registry to the extent that PCGS does, yet an objective view of the Registries may very well come to the conclusion that the NGC Registry is the better planned Registry.

 

10) Folks like you. Please, that is not a slam!!! I notice that you have been a registered member of NGC since mid-February yet have only posted about one dozen times. This is about once every three days, and many of those posts are in this thread. Certainly, over all this time there have had to be some interesting threads here at NGC for you to participate in, haven't there? I believe you wrote that you enjoy Bust coinage, well, I have started two threads in this time frame that specifically relate to Bust coinage and in each thread I ask for participation. If you are not familiar with me yet, my posts tend to be long and filled with information; this is an invitation to join the discussion and share. Your participation is not unique as there are many folks who choose not to contribute, even when the topic is directly in their interests.

 

You may recall that at the beginning of my post that I wrote that the NGC boards should not be described as being poorly followed and the reason for this is that we have an large number of folks who actively read the boards but do not participate. Thererfore, they seem to be followed well. I know this because I have received many emails following my posts from folks who read the NGC boards but who do not post. In these emails they share information with me, correct my errors, invite further discussion, set up meetings and generally write that they enjoy the NGC boards very much. Yet they are not visible members and that might make the NGC boards appear weaker than they truly are.

 

My opinion of the two boards is that they are both valuable, that the posting velocity at PCGS far exceeds that at NGC, that the signal-to-noise ratio at NGC is higher than that at PCGS and that I do not necessarily see these observations changing dramatically anytime soon.

 

I invite you to post more at NGC and to encourage others who enjoy our terrific hobby/industry to do the same.

 

TomB,

 

I see you are a man of few words.

 

Thank you so much for being so eloquent in stating what I was not able to write. I agree with at least 99% of what you wrote. My intention in starting this thread has been satisfied because of your words here.

 

I am a retired man who has collected coins for over 50 years and the opportunity to chat on these coin forums is very important to me. What else do I have to while away the hours?

 

My purpose in starting this thread was simply to stimulate interest in this forum, nothing more. If I have offended anyone by coming on too strong I do apologize.

 

To all the others who have responded in this thread, I thank you for showing an interest. It is my hope that we all together can make this forum a better place to be.

[Oldtrader3]

Good grief, I have been a member here for over three years! I left the other board early on when they started kicking members off for irritating HRH. Additionally I guess, because of STN ratio as Tom calls it. Besides, I decided if I was going to build Registry Sets, I would not be artificially limited to PCGS only. Having been a gold coin collector, I generally preferred NGC grading of gold coinage to PCGS.

 

Certainly not all of the subjects posted here are interesting to all of us, but I hope that we are a tolerant bunch towards others collecting interests and I feel that we try to provide best effort information for those who ask.

[cpm9ball]

I am a retired man who has collected coins for over 50 years and the opportunity to chat on these coin forums is very important to me. What else do I have to while away the hours?

 

My purpose in starting this thread was simply to stimulate interest in this forum, nothing more. If I have offended anyone by coming on too strong I do apologize.

 

To all the others who have responded in this thread, I thank you for showing an interest. It is my hope that we all together can make this forum a better place to be.

 

Mozin , you need not apologize to me. From time to time, I have been known to be a little headstrong...... "Damn the torpedos, full speed ahead! ....and perhaps I was too rash in my post. I look forward to the opportunity of learning from your experience.

 

By the way, "Welcome to the Boards!"

 

Chris

 

PS. I nominate Tom as "Official Spokesman for the Boards". Short and to the point! Well-stated!

[Mozin]

Chris,

 

Thanks for the kind words, AND for the welcome.

[TomB]

I think you started a terrific thread, Mozin, and look forward to your continued contributions to our knowledge.

 

I'm also glad that you could read my post for what it was; information instead of bashing.

[melmcbee]

All hail the Chief, TomB

 

Welcome to the boards Mozine.

[cpm9ball]

Chris,

 

Thanks for the kind words, AND for the welcome.

 

Where in Oregon do you live? I've got relatives scattered all over the state. On second thought, maybe I should tell you where they live so you can avoid them.

Coos Bay, Eugene, Salem, Springfield, Dexter, Portland.........

 

Chris

[spiny]

I've lived in four of those six and spent too much time in the other two!

[kryptonitecomics]

Group hug anyone?