• When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

GUESS THE GRADE - 1890-O Morgan dollar

28 posts in this topic

I took a chance on this one and put in the winning bid on eBay of $84.00. It looked like it had some promise and when I got it home it had a little more. Typical mushy O-mint strike but what a smooth cheek. Try and guess the grade that NNC gave it (doesn't really matter) and try and guess the grade that a real TPG will give it when I send it in. Which service should I send it to? I will post the grade later.

 

Thanks, Mike

 

 

 

p><p>   <img src=1890-O 3 by Balloon tire bikes, on Flickr[/img]

 

<a  href=https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7290/15825760283_1328ff81c4_b.jpg' alt='15825760283_1328ff81c4_b.jpg'>1890-O 4 by Balloon tire bikes, on Flickr[/img]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Chest looks worn.
As mentioned by the OP
Typical mushy O-mint strike. . .

 

1890 O's cap out at 66 at the 2 majors so I'm guessing NNC at least matched that. Seems to me there are enough ticks and marks for a "real TPG" to say 63.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I dont see how it's a weak claim to MS, and that picture of a 62 looks nothing like OP's coin. I say 64, shot at 65.... that's assuming there aren't any problems that I can't see in the pics. Nice pickup

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I see a thumb print on the obverse at 10 o'clock. Looks to have had an old cleaning and re-tone. Has the usual "O" mint strike. There are a few contact marks in prime areas (lower cheek, eagle's breast, above the ear). IMO, it might get a 64.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It looks like an MS63 to me. But with grading and postage fees added to the original cost, you will almost certainly go into a loss position. Why bother?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It looks like an MS 63 or 64. NNC with their lose liberal grading would have graded it higher.

 

Based on the value of the coin in MS 65 my guess is NNC gave it at least MS65 and you want to send it in to NGC or PCGS and hope for that grade. Chances of that happening are slim to none but if you are a gambler the cost to submit does not matter.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I dont see how it's a weak claim to MS, and that picture of a 62 looks nothing like OP's coin. I say 64, shot at 65.... that's assuming there aren't any problems that I can't see in the pics. Nice pickup

 

Thanks, there does not appear to be any problems; hairlines, rim bumps, etc., but you know this one will be picked apart as the TPGs are more hesitant on a coin like this IMO. Mushiness might keep it out of gem status even if all the planets align for everything else. If it was a an'81-S it would be MS64+ or better all day long.

 

It looks like an MS63 to me. But with grading and postage fees added to the original cost, you will almost certainly go into a loss position. Why bother?

 

This is the perfect coin to test many things; ones own grading skills, the current status of TPG grading standards, and the potential for a nice ROI.

 

It looks like an MS 63 or 64. NNC with their lose liberal grading would have graded it higher.

 

Based on the value of the coin in MS 65 my guess is NNC gave it at least MS65 and you want to send it in to NGC or PCGS and hope for that grade. Chances of that happening are slim to none but if you are a gambler the cost to submit does not matter.

 

 

NNC gave it a MS66. I am a gambler and will send it in for sure, not sure of the service yet. If it comes back as a 63 than I succeed in putting it in a respected holder to be enjoyed for what it is by any future owner - it won't be a coin that is scoffed at in an over-graded holder. If it comes back any higher than that is a bonus. we will see.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Chest looks worn.

 

O Mint Morgan’s have weak or no breast feathers – this is related to strike not due to wear.

 

Don't no much about Morgans. Assuming it's uncirculated, 64

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I dont see how it's a weak claim to MS, and that picture of a 62 looks nothing like OP's coin. I say 64, shot at 65.... that's assuming there aren't any problems that I can't see in the pics. Nice pickup

 

We are all judging from OP's pics. What I see is rub on high points on obverse and reverse. Specifically, the obverse hair line and cap and eagles breast on the reverse. I see diminished luster. This year and mint are known for weak strikes, this coins strike is weaker than most, but the strike should not impact the grade that much. The rub I see does. Before posting my response, I looked at a few examples on the Heritage web site.

 

Regarding the MS62 example I posted, compare the hair line and lower curls definition, compare the definition of the reverse, breast, etc .More importantly, note that the high point luster is not diminished.

 

As I said--we are all judging from the OP's pics.

 

Hope OP gets a high grade.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

We are all judging from OP's pics. What I see is rub on high points on obverse and reverse. Specifically, the obverse hair line and cap and eagles breast on the reverse. I see diminished luster. This year and mint are known for weak strikes, this coins strike is weaker than most, but the strike should not impact the grade that much. The rub I see does.

 

We all know how difficult it is to tell anything from a photograph viewed on a computer screen, in an effort to try and show a little more detail here is a quick and dirty iPhone video under fluorescent lighting. I will say that looking under mag, the luster is not disturbed on the high points, no perceivable wear can be seen - just the wildly soft strike areas on the eagle's breast and over Liberty's ear.

 

Video below:

 

1890-O_video

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think this coin comes back MS 61. Where other coins might show wear on the highest spots on this coin there's no wear because the high spots just aren't there. If a great coin strike might result in a grading increase in the loftier grades, certainly a lack of detail to this degree has to be taken to the woodshed and given a lower but mint state grade.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

things like a weak strike will affect grade. PCGS and NGC use ANA's grading standards, and if you wanted to you could buy the book, ANA's grading standards for grading US coins.... in that book you would find out exactly how much a weak strike like this would affect grade... it certainly doesn't warrant a 60 or a 61 just because it is weakly struck....

 

A weakly struck coin such as this, supposing it had the eye appeal, luster, and surface preservation, could grade as high as a MS65. (not that I think the coin pictured will or would get a 65, Im just saying that everyone who is guessing a 61 or 62 simply because of the weak strike could probably benefit by getting that grading book.). It is very inexpensive relative to the insight gained from reading it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

We are all judging from OP's pics. What I see is rub on high points on obverse and reverse. Specifically, the obverse hair line and cap and eagles breast on the reverse. I see diminished luster. This year and mint are known for weak strikes, this coins strike is weaker than most, but the strike should not impact the grade that much. The rub I see does.

 

We all know how difficult it is to tell anything from a photograph viewed on a computer screen, in an effort to try and show a little more detail here is a quick and dirty iPhone video under fluorescent lighting. I will say that looking under mag, the luster is not disturbed on the high points, no perceivable wear can be seen - just the wildly soft strike areas on the eagle's breast and over Liberty's ear.

 

Video below:

 

1890-O_video

 

Hope you get a higher grade than what I expect as stated in previous post. After all you have coin in hand and I am judging from pics and video. The video does not change my opinion, and it is my opinion only. I will point out a certain irony, that is that many posters quite often disagree with TPG grades. It will be interesting to see the discussion when you post your submission results

 

As you said in a previous post, this is a good coin to learn about TPG grading. I look forward to the results of your submission.

 

Carl

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, it's been 15 months since I started this post, sorry for the long delay. I do have grading results from PCGS today. Anyone else care to take a guess? '90-O's are notorious for being weakly struck.

 

Hint, it did come back with a numerical grade.

 

26845575722_f85e48a169_b.jpg1890-O 1$ PCGS by Mike, on Flickr

Link to comment
Share on other sites

64 is a reasonable grade for the coin . My original guess was a 63 or 64 .

It is a nice looking coin , I suppose they could have given it a Plus but that would be splitting hairs on the grade.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The weak strike and subdued luster prevent the coin from grading any higher than MS64, and the second set of photos reveals additional contact marks. I'll call it MS63. In NNC parlance, that probably translates to "MS66" for them.

 

An 1890-O in MS63 is probably worth $80-$110 in top tier plastic, and given the fingerprinting and eye appeal, I would expect this coin to sell for the lower end. My advice is to run, but if you like it, that is all that matters. If you try to cross this, you will be losing money. This date, while it carries a premium, isn't particularly rare and you can find another one with ease.

 

Edited: It looks like I didn't see that you crossed it as a 64. It looks better than your original images, and I am happy that you will come out in the green.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This one was graded MS64. Hardly a mark on it.

 

 

<a  href=https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7209/26919700916_b3aab631d8_b.jpg' alt='26919700916_b3aab631d8_b.jpg'>1890-O PCGS MS64 by Mike, on Flickr[/img]

 

The True Views make the surfaces look better than your second set of images.

Link to comment
Share on other sites