Rare Indian Cent, Not

[JTO]

This coin is anything but rare, just check out any major auction.

 

This coin was brought from Rick Snow. It got the PS designation but only, in my opinion, because of the date. This coin is poorly struck on the its right side, including the date and "AMERICA" on the obverse and the bow and arrows on the reverse. The fact that I bought it means the only person I really have to complain about is myself. I chose the coin. With that said I'm a bit tired of hearing that this is the toughest issue of the Indian series to obtain. This date is anything but rare. Because of the "value", er price, even in low grades, every auction has multitudes of 1877's. The only difficulty in obtaining a nice one is the depth of your bank account.

 

 

 

Compare this to the 1859 1c proof cameo Indian That I waited years to find a nice example with true cameo contrast. That is a rare coin. This is a pedestrian coin that costs and arm and leg.

 

See more journals by JTO

[Mohawk]

Hi JTO,

This is something I was discussing elsewhere on the boards here. You're right. An 1877 Indian Cent is not rare. Most U.S. coins, including those famous key dates, aren't rare. They just have an insane amount of demand for them at the present. Your observations are interesting and they are very similar to my experiences. If you have the money, you could buy these U.S. keys all day long.

 

[jackson64]

Excellent journal and definitely food for thought. I'm sure many may have some well thought out rebuttals, however I mostly agree with your summation.

 

I have another example---the 1916-D Mercury Dime. While there is no doubt about the limited mintage, the challenge of acquiring/finding a 1916-D is not much of a challenge at all.

 

If an auction has only a dozen or so mercury dimes for sale in the category, it is almost assured that 3 or 4 ( or more) will be 16-D's. Conversely, I have looked for years for certain mercury dimes. Some of the dates I seek are condition "rarities" at MS67 or 68 and others are extremely rare with FB designation ( look at the total pops of any FB 1945 or even 1944's in upper grades.)

 

Also, one can look at dozens of coins that sell for quite less than a 16-D and have much smaller mintages ( check out some of the Barber half mintages--or even the 3c nickel series which about half the dates are rarer than a 16-D.)

 

I could go on and on but your point does not need much defense---thanks for throwing it out there.

 

[Mohawk]

I thought I should link to the thread where I discuss the "rarity" of US Key issues, especially when compared to non-US coins ( which is largely what I collect) here. It might be an interesting read for you guys:

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=7916187#Post7916187

[World Colonial]

Excellent journal and definitely food for thought. I'm sure many may have some well thought out rebuttals, however I mostly agree with your summation.

 

I would really like to see these rebuttals because I do not believe there is a single one that cannot be refuted, easily.

 

The most common usage of rarity on this forum and likely with collectors of US coins generally is with any number of specialties: "grade rarities", "color rarity" (such as rainbow or "monster" toning), die varieties, "special designation strikes" and errors. I would add cameos to this list from the OP. These are at most narrow definitions of rarity and in my opinion usually arbitrary and artificial.

 

The other definition I have seen used here is supply-demand. This is how on one instance someone tried to claim that "key date" Morgans are "rare", even though every single one of them can be bought on demand except as I just described.

 

There is nothing wrong with collecting common coins if that is what you like. But many don't find it particularly challenging which is why I believe these specialties were extended to so many coins or even invented.

 

 

[Lucky One]

agreed, there are a lot of popular coins that aren't even close to rare, and you should chime in on the other threads that were posted recently on the subject. Nice 1859, definitely much rarer than the 1877 and a better value for sure...

[Lucky One]

Hi JTO,

This is something I was discussing elsewhere on the boards here. You're right. An 1877 Indian Cent is not rare. Most U.S. coins, including those famous key dates, aren't rare. They just have an insane amount of demand for them at the present. Your observations are interesting and they are very similar to my experiences. If you have the money, you could buy these U.S. keys all day long.

 

This is why I completely re-evaluated my collection and sold everything in favir of a truly rare and interesting series- liberty half eagles. To define rarity, you must collect a series with a ton of true rarities. Since this is the last major overhaul of my collection before retirement, and since I want the collection to hokd it's value, I am now a happy collector of liberty half eagles. Check out the series, and the quarter eagles as well, and you'll find some super low poulations and dozens of issues with less than a hundred coins known in all cnditions combined.

 

I don't know why I was spending hundreds or thousands of dollars for choice and gem Morgan dollars that had populations in the thousands when the liberty half eagles were just sitting there screaming for attention. I would imagine there are a couple other series with extremely low surviving numbers so why not re-evaluate your own collection and see if it is worthy of the term 'rare'? Great topics on the NGC forums today, really enjoying the thoughts and ideas of others in the hobby these days!

[Lucky One]

I thought I should link to the thread where I discuss the "rarity" of US Key issues, especially when compared to non-US coins ( which is largely what I collect) here. It might be an interesting read for you guys:

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=7916187#Post7916187

 

 

good point, however keep in mind that there are not anywhere near as many collectors searching for world coins as US coins. While the foreign sector is ripe with value, unless you have all the time in the world to sell your collection when the time comes, you are likely to lose a significan majority of your collection's value to the much weaker market when compared to rare US coins. That said, I had a lot of fun cherry picking foreign coins of the colonial era some years back, so it is much more fun to buy coins for ten or twenty cents on the dollar (compared to 'book' value) than pay 110% of book for that special US coin you have been trying to buy. Your post brought back the good memories of that endeavor. Thank you for the idea, I think I might go back to searching for more for that collection!

[RWB]

...Please do not pull the arms and legs off of pedestrians. It makes them angry.