How about different scores for AU's ??
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I am sure this question has been asked before,but in many early series and in gold this should be quite relevant. There is a huge difference from a 50 to a 58 not only in quality but also in price.

 

I think these scores would refine many of the differences in quality between sets in the registry and the new scores would reflect this.

 

Does anyone else have similar thoughts on this?

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They implement changes on request PER catagory - Why do them all when you do not have too.

 

I have them change the structure of the 1901-p Morgan - It took a while but they did change it some.

 

Make the request under the coin in questions review score button - not here

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You are correct. There is no diffeence in scores between an AU50 and an AU58. in the Registries I have seen.

 

 

The problem I have is that all the ones I have seen only get 3 points in any AU grade and 3 points seems to be low when you have an AU58 and get three points and a MS60 gets 100 or so.

 

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The problem I have is that all the ones I have seen only get 3 points in any AU grade and 3 points seems to be low when you have an AU58 and get three points and a MS60 gets 100 or so.

 

That's actually pretty typical in the registry. In many cases, point values were only calculated for coins that were commonly/likely to be added to registry sets. Below a certain grade level, when it becomes less likely that people will add coins of that grade, they just started putting in 3s and 1s for the points and 3 is usually the minimum number of points given to any low grade coin. If you think a coin deserves more points than it's getting, request a point correction. I've done it quite a bit.

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Depends on the Registry. I got a coin graded a few months ago. It is a 1880 S morgan that is a HOT 50 VAM 11 in MS64.

 

I needed to fill a slot so I put it in that slot and received 135 points. Later I saw that it was 272 points so I wrote NGC figuring it was a mistake and was told that it got more points in a HOT VAM Registry as they wanted it to be showcased as opposed to a regular registry.

 

 

I can understand this but low points such as a three which is almost zero doesn;t seem right because it is "least likely". There is a HOT 50 VAM Morgan that only has a population of one here and it is MS65.

 

 

Should there be very small points in other grades because it is least likely for another to show up.

 

I found a coin in one of my Albums that was a 1878 7TF Rev of 79 that was a AU58. NGC only gives 3 points for it. I sent it ANACS since NGC only recognizes the HOT 50 and top 100 vams.

 

It came back as a VAM 222 which is an R5 VAM.

 

In this case all AUs in just the 1878 are 3 points. an AU58 is only teo points from a MS60 which has at least a hundred points. If it was least likely for a MS60 then will that also become three points?

 

 

I have not seen that many graded as a MS60 unless it is the label that just lists them as Brillliant Unc which many say is just because they were graded in Bulk or at a discount for certain reasons.

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Sometimes the price difference between AU-50 and and AU-58 does not amount to much. In other cases, like early U.S. gold coins, it can mean thousands of dollars.

 

I can see where the registry would have a problem making this change. The re-programing would be a major undertaking.

 

Sitll it's something they need to consider for early U.S. coins. There is a big difference in value in a number of cases.

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for certain series it makes a lot of sense...for moderns..it's not really an issue..

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I think that there should be a difference in point values for the AU grade under the type coin registry. After all, there are leaps and bounds of differences between an AU50 and an AU58 in most cases.

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Sometimes the price difference between AU-50 and and AU-58 does not amount to much. In other cases, like early U.S. gold coins, it can mean thousands of dollars.

 

I can see where the registry would have a problem making this change. The re-programing would be a major undertaking.

 

Sitll it's something they need to consider for early U.S. coins. There is a big difference in value in a number of cases.

 

Well, they reprogrammed to allow for more points when they started awarding the "star" designation.

 

I definitely believe that breaking down the 50-58 grade range would have more of an impact and give collectors a better overall rankings system. This would only have to be done on the early series, say, seated coins and earlier. Maybe the barber collectors would want this too?

 

Type sets are a great idea and place to start (thumbs u

 

 

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Particularly if you are collecting Civil War and Reconstuction gold coins in AU where an AU58 can cost 5 times what an AU55 or AU53 does. It doesn't make sense to have one catch-all AU grade. Someone needs to rationalize scores for 19th century, AU scarce date/MM coin issues.

 

Also, other coins (i.e. Trimes after 1862) where prooflke coins are only assigned (3) registry points vs. 1000+ for business strikes. Many of these late type III Trimes were struck only on proof dies because of their minscule mintages. Most are PL. I have a MS64, 1863 Trime that is a business strike from a proof die but I won't send it in for regrade to PL because it will drop from over 1000 registry points to 3. All 20,000 business strike1863 Trimes were struck on proof dies and most are PL. All subsequent issues until 1873 are the probably the same. They are so scarce that finding many examples for strike comparison is very difficult.

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I don't at all see why it would be a big problem making this change. It actually sounds pretty easy. The registry already knows whether the coin is a 50, 53, 55 or 58 and Numismedia prices are already broken out by 50, 53, 55, or 58.

 

1st step is to add 4 new tables: AU-50, AU-53, AU-55, AU-58.

 

Next, pull coins from the original "AU" table and put them into the appropriate new AU-50, AU-53, AU-55, or AU-58 table based on their known grade and link to the correct Numismedia price.

 

Heck, after that you could even automate the initial scores just by dividing by the AU-50 price and using that as the factor to generate the new score, preventing it from exceeding more than 90% of the score of the next higher grade. Example:

 

AU-58 score calculated as: AU-58 price / AU-50 price x AU-50 score ( validation test: if result > MS-60*.9 then score instead = MS-60*.9 ).

 

You wouldn't have to keep those scores, obviously, but for entering so many new grades into each coin series it'd be the easiest way I can think of to get started.

 

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I asked, no response, no change

 

BIG BIG factor in Sydney Mint type II sovereigns

 

AU50 can be as low as VF Aussie

AU53 can be as low as VF

AU55 can be as low as aEF

AU58 can be as low as EF

 

Giving these coins so many points has pushed my MOSTLY choice mint state MS63-65 coins is losing to someones set with a particular "rare date" coins including 1860 below EF was getting over 7000 points or 1/3 of my total score (9 coin set).. its a very big help when you look closely. I refuse to buy common junk just for the points, it needs to be fixed

 

Its way out, anyone who knows Aussie grading of Syd Mint sovs have a look at the scores

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BTW doesnt the system already call the AU score 58 and automatically give you LESS than the quoted AU score, for 55 53 and 50 coins ?

 

ie if quoted AU value is 9000

 

AU58 gets 9000

55 gets say 7500

53 around 6500

50 around 5000

 

Pretty sure that is implemented..

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RareSov, not according to the check I just did on a AU53 I've got. It gets the full # of points listed for AU. The 58's do too, so no "bonus" for 58's.

 

 

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Wow, thats scrappy

 

I'm being beaten then mainly by what should be an AU50 anyway AU58, it would get the same points even if it was properly graded (PCGS) the coin is covered in damage, big rim nicks, heaps of wear.. something like 50% more points than my $7000 MS63 "common" date..

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[font:Comic Sans MS]Be careful what you ask for, you may just get it.

 

One route that NGC could go is to use the current AU registry points for 58 and then to rate down the points for 55, 53 and 50. This will result in lower overall scores.[/font]

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Just found this thread.

 

In my opinion, it is very unfair to group all AU grades into one. When I first noticed this in the NGC Registry, I thought I was understanding it wrong.

 

My collection of Capped Bust Half Dollars is mostly in AU58 grade, and they are much more costly than AU50 grade Busties. Generally, the low grade coins will cost half the 58 grade coins, sometimes even a larger spread.

 

Looks like the present Registry scoring system encourages collectors to buy only AU50 graded coins, and avoid the nicer ones.

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I believe the relative weight per coin should be finely tuned for each possible grade, not just MS and/or AU pieces.

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Just found this thread.

 

In my opinion, it is very unfair to group all AU grades into one. When I first noticed this in the NGC Registry, I thought I was understanding it wrong.

 

My collection of Capped Bust Half Dollars is mostly in AU58 grade, and they are much more costly than AU50 grade Busties. Generally, the low grade coins will cost half the 58 grade coins, sometimes even a larger spread.

 

Looks like the present Registry scoring system encourages collectors to buy only AU50 graded coins, and avoid the nicer ones.

 

This situation will exist in every countries coins too. The aussie syd mint 1857-1870 sovs are even more of a spread because the grading system has trouble with this particular type. Another reason for more detailed grades to be issued. AU58 and AU58 can be quite different pieces on this issue.

 

AU58 could be as much as 20 times the value of a AU50, of the same date

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How do we go about getting this corrected with NGC? Only NGC would need to make changes in their scoring, nothing would need be done by Registry participants.

 

Come on NGC, let's get with it!

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Guest Joiseygirl

This is on our list of programming tasks. I do not have a timeline for this but rest assured it is a goal.

 

Thank you,

 

Amy T. Lorenzo

'Joiseygirl'

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Great to hear that :) I figured as much. It was an OK system before, but it needs updating.. as most things do over time.

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I think appropriate weighting for AU coins is badly needed for many series. The price difference between AU50 and AU58 coins can be many fold, and the NGC Registry should reflect this. For example, many common date type 1 double eagles are nearly twice as expensive in AU58 compared with AU50 (based on Numismedia FMV Price Guide). Some early type 2 double eagles are more than 4x’s costlier in AU58 compared with AU50, eg, 1866-S, 1867-S and 1868.

 

I am happy to hear this change is coming.

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People who collect gold have been complaining about this since this registry was founded. To date it has fallen of deaf ears. Something else always seems to be more important. However, if you collect gold, this is one of the biggest hotbuttons on this site. It does not make a bit of sense to grade a coin that is AU58 the same as one that is AU50 and cost 1/10 the price of the AU58.

 

When all is said and done, it never changes, this issue continues to gather dust and is a big dissatisfier for many..

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It has been five months since Amy indicated they were working on changing the scores for the various AU grades. Wonder what is taking so long.

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