Ron Smith

My mistake The 1885 Brown proof in this picture is a 67

Well if thats the case this 66 Proof Brown 1885 NGC must be questionable color too. Its a bookend to my 98. I was hoping to get someome who was into Indian Heads when I got away from the water cooler bunch but I guess you guys are all over the place. I have over 100 UNC Indians and have been real busy. I see the insults are non stop here. Finding anyone on here that specializes on Indian Head Cents seems to be impossible I guess. Indian Proofs of the purple blue tone is very common. If you go on Ebay right now there are two dealers that have plenty of them up for sale. They probably sell more graded NGC coins than anyone on ebay. All I can say is I hope you guys aren't graders for them. It kind of looks like you would be a little bias the way you have been treating me I probably won't have a chance. I have sent many coins into NGC and PCGS in the past and have about an 85% grading avg. Anyway. If you have some copper to view let me have a crack at them. I will be very honest too. Ha ha

I'm thinking 66 Brown on the 1886 and a 65-66 Red on the 1898. The two small carbon spots on the 86 or I would have a real shot at a 67. The strike color and luster on this coin looks much better than the only 67 brown NGC graded close to 20 years ago in a magnified look I saw of it sold on a Heritage auction in my opinion. The strike is prooflike. This 1898 proof Indian is another I am submitting. Great strike and color. Near flawless. I'm thinking a 66 Brown on this one too. Anyway I have a pic of the only 67 1886 Type one NGC has graded. I just don't see the same quality as mine. I would think the blotches and a few small hits would be more of an annoying than two pin sized spots. My probably biased opinion of course

This 1886 Type one is a business strike but has an incredible strike and luster. The 1898 is beautiful gold tone. I feel they should grade quite well

I'm pretty much done here guys but I do have a few things to say. To those that say that the 67 1886 is superior to mine I guess my question to you is while the pictures I presented to you of my coins are so close they sit on your eyelids you choose to defend pictures of a coin that is so far away it's hard to make out much of anything. Let me ask you this. If those two microscopic brown dots that you say destroy my coin were on that coin in the 67 holder would you be able to tell from the distance that holder was away that you choose to defend. That was the exact picture used by Heritage Auctions. I did blow up the 67 and there are light and dark patches all over it. If you were to break it out I would bet it wouldn't get a 65. If the pictures you show of a coin are only taken from a distance there is good reason for it. They are trying to hide something. I guess I came on here for opinions which I was given. Now I will give mine. Coins in old holders on almost every occasion I have bought them and I have been dealing in Indians almost exclusively for over 30 years have been over graded. Long before grade manipulation was ever thought of back in the mid 80's when this craziness started loose grading was no big deal. Once the number of highly graded coins from each year were established grading became much more strict in order to keep the prices high for those in shall we say the elite class. Obviously if you flood the market with a bunch of 66 or 67 graded coins it drops the price and the bigshots that spend all of the money with the supposedly top notch coin grading companies get pissed off watching the value of their precious investments tumble. What better way to stop that then tighten the grading. Go on Heritage Auctions and look for yourself. A high majority of the top graded coins are in old holders. Are they better than the coins graded today. Nope. Not even close. Most likely worse. Its all about the money.

Here is a 66 Variety 2 next to mine. Sorry guys you can say all you want. There is no way to say the coin on the left could look better than mine on the right. Luster strike and color far superior to the the one on the left. You could take pictures of the one on the left all day or put it under a scope and not change that. You take away those couple of little dots you have a 68. This coin is struck like a proof. You can go through the achieves in Heritage auctions and there are no business strike 86 browns that look like this. There are a couple of proofs that look similar that are brown 66 but that is it. Color luster and strike beat out two very minor spots.

A couple of different shots

Hi. The luster on the 1855 is extremely high. The pics don't do it justice and there is some nice flashy red coming through on the reverse very original hard to see in the photos so the odds of it being recolored don't seem too high. A recolored coin would look more dull and I doubt they would recolor just one side. The patina on this one is really super.

A real nice brown 1885 Great luster some red poking through and not a spot on it. The 91 has a couple of spots but the strike luster and color not to mention a hard one for me to find in the raw for less than a hundred bucks I had to have it.

Actually acquired bookend 1900's from a guy who had a roll of these. We will see how it goes

My 98 The obverse is near flawless hopefully it carries the reverse which has slight toning for a 65 Red The 92 Hoping for a 65RB as it is lightly toned

A couple more hopefuls Not big on Large cents but this one caught my eye. I rarely find raw ones this nice. The 95 Indian is a great coin except the discoloration reverse on the N but I think the rest of the coin should carry it.

I guess I might as well show my 98 proof and my 1902 while I'm at it. I think these should come back pretty good as well.

Here is the 67. Lifeless nowhere near the strike luster or color. Which one would you want. This one even looks blotchy