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JUST SO YOU KNOW, IT'S STILL HAPPENING

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THE WELSH DRAGON

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This letter was sent to me on July 6th....

 

Hello Mr. Deeds,

I am disappointed to learn this has happened again and I apologize for the inconvenience to you. Of course you may send them back to be corrected at no cost to you.

In addition to speaking with our encapsulation and QC personnel, NGC President, Rick Montgomery is now involved and we have prepared a set of criteria for all of our graders and QC specialists to follow to see that this does not continue. You are welcome to note which side up on your submission form -- this information will be provided to the QC specialist.


We appreciate you taking the time to contact us once again and we look forward to providing the level of service you should expect from NGC.

Best regards,
Dena
 
 
That was less than 60 days ago, and it has happened two more times. 
The Maundy set that is pictured below is the second time/set that has come back to me like this.
If the president of the company can not correct this then I have no idea what to do. 

4 PENCE.jpg

3 PENCE.jpg

2 PENCE.jpg

1 PENCE.jpg

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It appears to me that the quality control was either on vacation or slumped senseless in a corner somewhere.

Should not happen once, let alone more than that.

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Two other comments, Dragon King.

First, VERY nice set.

Second, maybe call the president of NGC. Time to wake him/her up too.

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RMW, 

Thank you.  I thought it would grade out as a proof set.  It looks proof-like to me.

Man, if I thought for even a second that he would talk to me I would call him up. But we both know he doesn't have time for me.

 

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You might be surprised if you talk to Dena and bark a bit and ask to speak to him. From her reply, she is fully aware of what has happened.

As to your query,Maundy sets of this period always come out like this. I have some similar ones which I havent graded (yet). Bought them years ago.

BTW, as you are interested in Maundy sets, Ive just set up competitive 1909 and 1924 sets on the website.

There were a number of years in the 1890s up to 1908 where Maundy sets were produced for collectors as well as for the ceremony itself. So in 1908 the mintage of sets was somewhere between 8000 and 9000. But this practice stopped that year, and so the 1909 set (as well as the 1910) are far more rare for Edward VII, with mintages down to around 2200 sets. I picked up the 1909 set earlier this year and submitted it. Fortunately for me, they didnt put any pieces in backwards, and it got phenomenal grades.

The 1924 set is also interesting, as soon after the end of World War I, in 1918, Britain changed the silver content in its coinage from well over 90 percent silver to 50 percent. So, to my knowledge, for the rest of the reign of George V, Maundy sets were made out of 50 percent silver. All the Maundy sets from 1921 to 1936 that I have seen before now appear to be quite dull due to the lower silver content, as does most of the regular coinage from those years. Except for this set. I dont know if was a special set made from 900+ fine silver, but it sure looks like it. Regular Maundy sets only reverted back to contain .925 fine silver in 1947.

 

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Man, you sure know a lot about this.  I would love to do more research on the coins I collect, but between my training  (powerlifting) and my two girls I have very little free time. 

You sure do good on your grades. I do cartwheels when I get a 66, and it looks like that's your lowest grade. Both the 1924 and the 1909 are nothing but 66's and 67's! I would say I like the 1924 set better but I can't because my grandfather was born in 1909 (he came here from Wales) and that year will always be first for me.

Oh, I know what I wanted to ask. If all the maundy sets after 1947 are .925 silver then why don't NGC put an "S" on the label in front of the 1P, 2P, 3P, & 4P?

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This is not that uncommon. I just received 3 coins with the wrong attribution (one with the wrong country no less) that were sent for correction. I still have a few that I need to sent back to be fixed. Wrong labels are becoming too frequent and while they will eventually correct them, it takes time, many emails, and money.

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With MS grades like those I really hate to send in some PL business strikes!! I guess MS is so easy to designate these days lol 

MS66????   Those look to be at least PF69UC's. 

Edited by Six Mile Rick

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Hello Everyone,

Thank you for all the great comments. 

I just wanted to make sure I clarified the original reason for the post. Although I have had numerous problems with labeling and other issues, this post was to address the mounting issue. If you look at the pics you will see that the 4 coins pictured were graded and stabbed in order and yet you can see that 3 were mounted forward and one was mounted backwards. I'm sure that you will agree that there is no reason to do this and it makes no sense. 

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ALL Maundy sets from at least the late 1800s to the present time were meant to have a prooflike finish in the regular sets, to my knowledge. NGC it seems gives a PL designation to some Maundy pieces and not others. But if the coins are in original condition, they ALL should be at least PL in this period.

I also learned that in the late 1800s to 1927 the prooflike finish was all that supposedly made the difference between the Maundy 3P and the silver 3P used in circulation . The  version made to circulate in commerce or for the colonies was NOT prooflike. Otherwise, I am told, the design is exactly the same. After 1927, the design of the currency silver 3P was changed.

Ive picked up this knowledge from a 35-40 year specialist in world and British coins. He has taught me a lot. We both started collecting in the 1970s. He turned pro then and I went to college and a career and stopped collecting until I retired some years ago and renewed acquaintences (sp?). He was also the source of most of the Edward VII pennies Ive recently posted, which came from the Baldwins Vault in London and were saved by Baldwins when they were originally issued. Baldwins, a coin dealer in London, has been in business since 1872.

There is a book out there on the history of the Maundy coinage by Robinson. I haven't picked it up yet but intend to.

Anyway, everyone, I hope that these continuing issues with NGC get dealt with.

Edited by rmw

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15 hours ago, THE WELSH DRAGON said:

Hello Everyone,

Thank you for all the great comments. 

I just wanted to make sure I clarified the original reason for the post. Although I have had numerous problems with labeling and other issues, this post was to address the mounting issue. If you look at the pics you will see that the 4 coins pictured were graded and stabbed in order and yet you can see that 3 were mounted forward and one was mounted backwards. I'm sure that you will agree that there is no reason to do this and it makes no sense. 

It is all the same problem... Placing coins with the wrong orientation, label errors, designation errors, mechanical errors. It is all lack of attention to detail, and afraid to say, ignorance on the series. 

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jackson64,

Yes, I remember your post.  And I thought about your post often as I was dealing with all these orders that were coming back like this.  I did want to write you and ask if yours were in different orders or were they in the same order like mine?  Not that them being in different orders makes it ok, but when they are right in a row and in the same order then it makes it look like they are doing it on purpose.  Your thoughts?

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For British coins anyway, obverse and reverse are pretty simple. If a Monarchs portrait is on the coin, that's the obverse.

its tough to get that wrong .

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Yes, it has even happened for the same series. Sometimes I'll send in 4 or 5 different 10c or $2 Canada coins  but of mixed years and some get the queen obverse on the front and some get the design of the sailing ship or polar bear facing forward..it appears to be purely random, willy-nilly as if they don't have much concern about which side faces forward.

One can look up a popular series like Canada $20 issues on ebay, and you'll see how arbitrary NGC is with which side faces forward in the holder ( the Queen obverse or the Commem design) Whatever they decided as policy would be fine with me--just would like some consistency instead of the evident, 'whatever, who cares" attitude that is obvious.

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